H.R. 822 being heard tomorrow 8/13/11


Cross your fingers, here its comes. The battle for national CCW reciprocity begins tomorrow 9/13/11. What do you think?

A. Long hard battle for no good outcome!
B. We have a chance!
C. Better luck next year!
 

I'm gonna have to go with "A" or "C". Even if it passes the House, which it very well may do, it will be DOA in the Senate. Scummy Harry Reid is never gonna even let it get to the floor. If conservatives can win enough seats in the Senate and keep, or gain more, control in the House, it might have a shot under a new Republican administration and Congress.
 
Harry Reid is not one of my favorite people. Do you think the bill could be snuck into the (whenever it happens) budget agreement?
 

jcarmody

New member
This is another example of why "majority rule" is bad. Carrying a gun is not bad so no government has a moral right to prevent it. Folks that worship at the altar of "Democracy" simply accept the fact that a democratically-elected government can/will do whatever it wants and we're just doomed to suffer through it until next term. Just withdraw your consent and maybe they'll go away (it's as likely to work as voting in someone else, I'm just sayin').
 

B2Tall

Stirrer of the Pot
A.

A pipe dream. A nice one, but a pipe dream none the less.

When it comes to firearms, state's rights will win out. This isn't like recognizing another state's drivers license, which are considered necessary and vital to commerce, etc. Unfortunately states like Illinois, New Jersey, California, and Hawaii aren't just going to chuck their gun laws, and I believe that the Supreme Court will back them on this one.
 

mappow

New member
OK, so we're really wanting the FED's to "Nationalize a Permitting Process"? Can anyone point out just one program the FED's do correctly without error or prejudice? Would this be the first step into a National Registration of Firearms? Just a few questions to ponder. Tell me again about the 10 Amendment of the US Constitution. Or are we going to again step all over States Rights to facilitate a National Agenda of Gun Control. Jus sayn'
 

Providence Ranch

New member
Unfortunately, it is now a battle between 2A and 10A. Which one will win out? The bigger issue is that the framers of our Constitution designed them so that they never would be in conflict. The states have taken it upon themselves to go above the 2A, and place state-specific limitations upon gun ownership. And even within states, carry rights vary wildly from county to county. In Cal-LEFT-fornia, moving from one county to another is like changing nationality!

Now, I am a staunch supporter of both the 2A and the 10A, but in this case I believe the states need to be corrected. Bring it back ok line with the constitution across the board. Is it a pipe dream? Maybe. But HR 218 did go through, granting peace officers reciprocity in all 50 states. Why shouldn't properly permitted civilians be extended the same courtesy?

So maybe there is hope, but I guard my hope well out of fear that this may be a staging ground for more oppressive blanket legislation from the federal level. Go ahead, call me a conspiracy theorist. You won't be the first, or the last. :)
 

njsportsman

New member
Humor me here for a minute let's say it passes. What does that mean for me I live in New Jersey but, have a Florida CCW will that allow me to carry in New Jersey?
 

B2Tall

Stirrer of the Pot
If you read the bill, it only allows for reciprocity between states that actually issue permits. Apparently a "shall not" issue state like Illinois would be exempt since they don't issue a permit under any circumstances. If such a bill were to pass, it seems to me that states like California, NJ, and other "may issue" states would almost be forced to eliminate permits all together so as to prevent residents from other states CCing while there. It could backfire and result in "may issue" states becoming "shall not" issue states.
 
Cross your fingers, here its comes. The battle for national CCW reciprocity begins tomorrow 9/13/11. What do you think?

A. Long hard battle for no good outcome!
B. We have a chance!
C. Better luck next year!

Regardless of the outcome, it's good to keep pushing it. Eventually maybe we'll have reps in both houses who will pass it and a Pres who will sign it into law! BUT, I'm with you... cross your fingers!
 

Tucker's Mom

New member
It's kinda hard to choose between A and C ... though I am more hoping with B. If many will start supporting one another maybe we can have a B. It is a nice dream though...
 

jtg452

Member
I just looked over the official summary and IF it passes without any of the normal amendments and such foolishness, then it's the exact thing I want the federal government to do and it is the maximum extent of Federal involvement in the Concealed Carry issue I would like to see.

The bill forces the states to recognize each others permits. That is part of what the Federal government was designed to do- arbitrate between the states and make them get along. Your marriage license is recognized in all 50 states- even if the age of consent and exact requirements like blood work are not the same. I don't see why my concealed carry permit shouldn't be recognized in every state that has a similar law on the books.

We don't need more Federal involvement in concealed carry. A National (read Federal government controlled) concealed carry permit is not the way to go. The states have a certain degree of independence BUT they still have to get along and recognize the decisions of other states.
 

mrjam2jab

New member
Humor me here for a minute let's say it passes. What does that mean for me I live in New Jersey but, have a Florida CCW will that allow me to carry in New Jersey?

No it would not. You could use your FL permit to carry in every other state except IL and your home state. To carry in your home state you must have a home state permit.
 

jtg452

Member
Humor me here for a minute let's say it passes. What does that mean for me I live in New Jersey but, have a Florida CCW will that allow me to carry in New Jersey?

No, it would do away with the need for nonresident permits to exist. If you have a permit for your home state, it would be good in ANY state that has a concealed carry permit law as long as you are following the law of the state you are in. If I went to NJ with my AL permit, under this law I would be legally able to carry as long as I follow the NJ laws.
 

jg1967

New member
Unfortunately, it is now a battle between 2A and 10A. Which one will win out? The bigger issue is that the framers of our Constitution designed them so that they never would be in conflict. The states have taken it upon themselves to go above the 2A, and place state-specific limitations upon gun ownership. And even within states, carry rights vary wildly from county to county. In Cal-LEFT-fornia, moving from one county to another is like changing nationality!

Now, I am a staunch supporter of both the 2A and the 10A, but in this case I believe the states need to be corrected. Bring it back ok line with the constitution across the board. Is it a pipe dream? Maybe. But HR 218 did go through, granting peace officers reciprocity in all 50 states. Why shouldn't properly permitted civilians be extended the same courtesy?

So maybe there is hope, but I guard my hope well out of fear that this may be a staging ground for more oppressive blanket legislation from the federal level. Go ahead, call me a conspiracy theorist. You won't be the first, or the last. :)

What's the skinny on HR218? I have not really heard much about that?
 

BIGTUNA62

New member
No, it would do away with the need for nonresident permits to exist. If you have a permit for your home state, it would be good in ANY state that has a concealed carry permit law as long as you are following the law of the state you are in. If I went to NJ with my AL permit, under this law I would be legally able to carry as long as I follow the NJ laws.

I guess thats bad news for me because I would rely on a non resident permit. I am in the process of getting a Florida non res. because I cannot get a CCW in NJ its impossible here so, I rely on non res permits to carry in other states like PA for instance.
 

Providence Ranch

New member
jg1967:229245 said:
What's the skinny on HR218? I have not really heard much about that?

It's called the Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act of 2004. Part of Homeland Defense. It is very succinct. Basically it grants any peace officer with off duty carry privileges the right to carry in all 50 states. I said reciprocity above, but that's not exactly true. It goes farther than that by granting LEOs exemption from state laws prohibiting the carrying of concealed firearms. There are certain requirements, but very reasonable. Check it out. If you are LEO or retired LEO, you may have more carry rights than you knew.

http://www.leaa.org/218/218text.html

Enjoy!
 

mrjam2jab

New member
I guess thats bad news for me because I would rely on a non resident permit. I am in the process of getting a Florida non res. because I cannot get a CCW in NJ its impossible here so, I rely on non res permits to carry in other states like PA for instance.

You could still use a FL permit to carry in PA...just not in NJ.

It's possible that a result of this is that states AZ, FL, UT, etc might decide they no longer have to issue to non-residents...but I doubt they would want to give up that revenue source.
 

B2Tall

Stirrer of the Pot
You could still use a FL permit to carry in PA...just not in NJ.

It's possible that a result of this is that states AZ, FL, UT, etc might decide they no longer have to issue to non-residents...but I doubt they would want to give up that revenue source.

There's no way those gun-friendly states would do away with CC, but other not-so-friendly states like NJ or Hawaii might very well do so. They hardly issue any permits in the first place so they don't have much to lose. I find it hard to believe that the "anti" states would simply do a 180 and allow people to CC just because of this law.
 

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