Gunshot Suicide at Range


Ruger Lady

New member
This is an awful thing to happen and this range made a terrible mistake but New York politicians will take full advantage probably by not allowing ranges to rent any guns or ammo to anyone. Notice how the Post had to note about the Columbine "massacre", since they are anti-gun. You'd think they'd want to write more than one sentence about this poor young man and his life cut short.

GUNSHOT SUICIDE AT RANGE - New York Post

GUNSHOT SUICIDE AT RANGE
UN SON UNSUPERVISED
By PHILIP MESSING

June 17, 2008 -- The 20-year-old college-student son of a globetrotting UN staffer fatally shot himself in the head at a popular Chelsea rifle range that had sold him ammunition, rented him a high-powered rifle - and left him on his own, The Post has learned.

The bizarre suicide of Patrick Karorero happened June 3 inside the West Side Pistol Range on West 20th Street, which caters to Wall Street types, law-enforcement officials and shooting hobbyists.

It's where Robert De Niro, playing cabby Travis Bickle in the 1976 movie "Taxi Driver," was filmed staring down a barrel of a gun.

The range's owner, Robert Derrig, did not return calls for comment, and the NYPD said only the tragedy was "under investigation."

The mayor's office, which has waged a highly publicized campaign against gun violence, also declined to comment.

Sources familiar with the case provided the following account:

Karorero, who had first visited the range on May 20, paid a $25 range fee and purchased three boxes, or 150 rounds, of 9mm ammunition for an additional $45.

He was then rented a Hi-Point 9mm carbine rifle for another $40 and left alone to practice.

The Hi-Point is the same type of rifle wielded by one of the gunmen in the Columbine HS massacre.

At about 9 p.m., some two hours after showing up, a jittery Karorero waited for several other target shooters near him to leave the area.

Then, after looking distractedly to either side, he fired a rifle shot into his head.

The bullet tore a hole in the ceiling of the range, which is in the basement of an office building.

The tragedy - captured on surveillance tape - was ruled a suicide by the Medical Examiner's Office. Karorero left no note.

The city's administrative code states, "Any person under the age of 21 years may carry, fire or use any rifle or gun in the actual presence or under the direct supervision of any person who is the holder of a rifle or shotgun permit." The same provision applies to buying ammunition.

The range has cameras, and employees may have been watching him on a monitor. But experts consulted by The Post said that would not constitute "direct supervision."

Karorero, who was born in the African country of Burundi, had been living in the United States since August 2002 and was studying computer science at Plattsburgh State University.

His father, Pascal Karorero, a Rwandan national, rushed home from Chad, where he is based.

"He should not have been allowed on the range," the elder Karorero insisted. "If you run this type of business, you should exercise supervision throughout."

"I was completely taken aback that he was involved in any type of firearms activities - he was involved in computer games."

The dad said that due to his UN work, his son had been raised in various war-torn African countries.

"It seems to me," he said, "that it is much, much easier to have access to a gun here than it is elsewhere."

END
 

This is a good illustration as to why we as gun owners need to exercise extreme caution when allowing folks to handle/use our firearms. It could happen just about anywhere if the conditions are just right.





gf
 

toreskha

Titles are un-American.
The Hi-Point is the same type of rifle wielded by one of the gunmen in the Columbine HS massacre.
Not this crap again. Big deal, so they used a Hi-Point carbine. So what?

Why did this guy have to burden others with his death wish? He could have just gone to a bridge like everyone else, or overdosed on drugs.
 
I never leave anyone alone with a gun unless I know them REAL well. Personally if I were running a range, I'd staff a good range master. Thats a given especially in areas where people are not hugely exposed to guns as tools. Just MHO. Its a shame it happened, but the kid was probably determined no matter what to go the suicide path, too bad close friends or family were not paying more attention. Although sometimes you just don't see it, I had a friend go out that way. This is just another thing for the antis to grab ahold of and poorly use as a political message. Personally I think it is disgusting to use someones death to further your cause. Although the usual crap is in it. They talk about hollywood and call the 9mm carbine a "high powered" rifle. Well at least they did not use "assault". It always seems to me that the antis only references and exposure to guns are straight from hollywood.
 

HK4U

New member
The anti gunners I am sure will be all over this but it is almost impossible to protect someone from themselves. If a person is intent on taking their own life they will do if with or with out the gun. It is sad that someone would think that things were so bad they had to do this but it would not be any less a tragedy if he used a car or a bottle of pills. The enemies of our constitution would like to use it to further their own agenda though.
 

Scarecrow

New member
here we go again... this kind of crap pisses me off. it's all the gun's fault.. with their logic here if he did not have access to a gun he would still be alive. now that's debateable. if some one wants to kill him/herself, he/she is going to do it one way or another. look at japan. guns are rare over there, yet they have one of the highest suicide rates. STOP BLAMING THE GUNS YOU STUPID MEDIA MORONS. it's not the gun's fault that these people are sick. such stupidity should not be tolerated. and how is a 9mm carbine a "high power rifle"????
 

KimberPB

New member
Sad story but this has happened at two different ranges around my area this year. But like all of you said first a 9mm carbine is NOT a high powered rifle. Second, if someone is bent on killing themselves they will with whatever tool they have easily available.

Like Scarecrow said I was reading an article awhile back were there was a rash of suicides were people would mix household chemicals to create lethal fumes. Not only did it kill them but in one case several other people in the apartment complex became very sick.

A pistol in the hands of one man serves only as a tool of defense and protection were as the same pistol in the hands of another man bring death and destruction. In either case the pistol never changed only the mans intent did.
 

KimberRB

New member
The sad thing here is a young man lost his life. Any time someone dies it is very sad for the family and friends. And what does the Post focus on is not the fact that a young life was wasted but rather on the GUN! That is what Pisses me off. My prayers go out to the family. VERY VERY SAD!
 
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The media here in HI doesn't report on suicides. Even if it's a "public figure" like a local entertainer, politician, etc., other than to say that the person died.

Says a lot about a news agency when they use the death of a troubled individual to further their political agenda.



gf
 

Ektarr

Dedicated Infidel
"He should not have been allowed on the range," the elder Karorero insisted. "If you run this type of business, you should exercise supervision throughout."
Of course. It stands to reason that if he hadn't been able to shoot himself all of his suicidal tendencies would have been thwarted and he would have gone on to a long, norrmal life...right?

I think, instead of blaming his suicide on the availability of a gun (which he went through some manipulations and contortions to achieve, I see), perhaps his family conditions (not to mention the possible influence of the political situations in his African homes of Burundi and Rwanda [and did I mention his father is a UN Dipolmat? That may have depressed him! It would me!!]) should come under scrutiny. SOMEbody has to be blamed other than the kid who actually DID it, Dammit!

Why can't they just be sad and mourn for a kid who had what he felt were insurmountable problems, and regret his passing, instead of always having to lay blame?!
 
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toreskha

Titles are un-American.
SOMEbody has to be blamed other than the kid who actually DID it, Dammit!

Why can't they just be sad and mourn for a kid who had what he felt were insurmountable problems, and regret his passing, instead of always having to lay blame?!
Shhhh...self-responsibility is an obscene concept. If I choke someone to death with a clotheshanger, that's obviously Ikea's fault for making an object so conveniently shaped for such devious purposes.

Not that I ever have or anything...but they are perfectly shaped for that purpose.
 
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Scarecrow

New member
Shhhh...self-responsibility is an obscene concept. If I choke someone to death with a clotheshanger, that's obviously Ikea's fault for making an object so conveniently shaped for such devious purposes.

Not that I ever have or anything...but they are perfectly shaped for that purpose.

aaah yes grasshoppa... now you are beginning to think like a liberal.
 

ricardo900

New member
Hi guys, first time poster here.

I was at the range and saw the guy who committed suicide and he had a disturbing vibe to him. He was there for at least two hours and was not socializing or talking to anybody, I mean not even eye contact. I knew something was off about him and me and couple of other members were talking about him. It's sad that he decided to take his life, I left right before he killed himself and I read in todays paper that Byian got his licenses pulled by the city, that's tragic because Byian is good guy and if he knew this guy was unstable, he would have taken that rifle from him. I believe that kid was determined to do it, no matter what and Byian was watching this kid most of the time, but since there is no time limit, the minute a phone rings, he would be left alone. Tragic event.
'SUICIDE' GUN-TUTOR DISARMED - New York Post
 

Scarecrow

New member
Hi guys, first time poster here.

I was at the range and saw the guy who committed suicide and he had a disturbing vibe to him. He was there for at least two hours and was not socializing or talking to anybody, I mean not even eye contact. I knew something was off about him and me and couple of other members were talking about him. It's sad that he decided to take his life, I left right before he killed himself and I read in todays paper that Byian got his licenses pulled by the city, that's tragic because Byian is good guy and if he knew this guy was unstable, he would have taken that rifle from him. I believe that kid was determined to do it, no matter what and Byian was watching this kid most of the time, but since there is no time limit, the minute a phone rings, he would be left alone. Tragic event.
'SUICIDE' GUN-TUTOR DISARMED - New York Post


yes it's sad that people blame the gun and don't let the people be responsable for their own actions. it's a crying shame.
and welcome to the forum.
 

toreskha

Titles are un-American.
yes it's sad that people blame the gun and don't let the people be responsable for their own actions. it's a crying shame.
Worse than that, normal people who aren't aware that someone is a mental case have to be responsible for those who should be under the care of a psychiatrist. Regular people are bad enough, but adding suicidal tendencies makes it a powder keg.
 

ishi

New member
How inconsiderate. The guy clearly wasn't thinking about the poor sap who'd have to clean up the mess.
 

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