Fuel is now 3.59 9/10 per Gal

[festus]

Fuel costs have soared here and I for one am miffed. Why have the Sheeple not lost their minds and revolted?
I'll tell you why. They have bought off on the economy is heading towards a recession hook line and sinker. They believe all the crap they are told on CNN. This is one case where the Media is Making a difference in the worst way. The economy will recover quicker if the media will quit spreading doom and gloom journalism. If the people get out and spend their hard earned coin on stuff the need and stuff they want...the economy will recover. It took the US getting into world war 2 to break the curse of the great depression. This is not half as bad and the Media is not going to be happy until the sheeple are scared to spend so much as a dime on any luxury.

There is hope! Oil reserves have been discovered in Brazil that make the middle east look like the mom and pop operation they should be. If the US can broker a deal to help liberate that oil from the ground and keep Brazil out of OPEC. We can tell the Middle east to Bugger Off as they say in the UK. I for one,:austin_powers: am all for giving OPEC the single digit salute!

 

[NDS]

There is hope! Oil reserves have been discovered in Brazil that make the middle east look like the mom and pop operation they should be. If the US can broker a deal to help liberate that oil from the ground and keep Brazil out of OPEC. We can tell the Middle east to Bugger Off as they say in the UK. I for one,:austin_powers: am all for giving OPEC the single digit salute!

There's always something wonderful just around the bend, over the horizon, at the end of the tunnel--2 weeks, 5 years, 20 years, just as soon as there's a breakthrough, as soon as the market price warrants it-- ad nauseum.

Since I was a teenager (long ago in a place called the Sixties) I've been waiting for nuclear, geothermal, alcohol, oil shale, biomass, off-shore drilling, anwar, injection, wind, solar, (getting the idea yet?)

I'm tired of all this. I just want someone to become serious about providing adequate energy at an affordable price. I don't want any more 'government programs' that will be forgotten as soon as the tax breaks are expired.

I know I sound very cynical. Well, if I sound cynical it is probably because I am.

 

[KimberPB]

I agree gas prices are getting out of hand! Thanks God for my bike. 3 1/2 gallons and I'm good for 140 miles.

 

[DarrellM5]

I've parked my Ford F250 Crew Cab Powerstroke diesel and reclassified it as a lawn ornament. My $40,000 5th Wheel Toy Hauler is now an overpriced garage. Now, we're just using the diesel VW Jetta (43mpg) and the motorcycles. I really feel for the people who were already struggling to make ends meet. At the current rate of fuel price increases, it won't be long before a gallon costs the same as minimum wage. I also expect that grocery prices will go through the roof.

 

[HK4U]

...and the sky rocketing fuel prices are helping to drive the price of everything else up. Couple that with the fact that there already shortages for some grains especially corn because the governments idiotic plan of turning corn into ethanol and you have times that could approach that of the great depression (or worse).

And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand.

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine. Rev.6:5-6


Are we seeing the beginning of what the bible describes as the end times. I don't know for sure, no ones does. I do know one thing and that is a careful study of scriptures along side of the news will make you stop and think. What ever you believe about this,one thing is for certain and that is we probably have not seen the worst of it yet.

 

[kwo51]

Ill work for ammo.

 

[toreskha]

Oil reserves have been discovered in Brazil that make the middle east look like the mom and pop operation they should be.

That's fine, if you don't mind importing a bunch of oil from Brazil. We're currently learning our lesson about the difficulties involved with importing a critical good, and furthermore, the problems associated with importing those things from areas near politically volatile regions. Chavez is still in control and some commies recently took control in Paraguay. South America really isn't ideally stable.

There's always something wonderful just around the bend, over the horizon, at the end of the tunnel--2 weeks, 5 years, 20 years, just as soon as there's a breakthrough, as soon as the market price warrants it-- ad nauseum.

Since I was a teenager (long ago in a place called the Sixties) I've been waiting for nuclear, geothermal, alcohol, oil shale, biomass, off-shore drilling, anwar, injection, wind, solar, (getting the idea yet?)

That's pretty much the history of the world for you. Energy has always been expensive at some level - even if it takes some time to realize at what level that is. Now we're bearing more of the cost of our gasoline directly, rather than having so much of it subsidized. Biofuels are also heavily subsidized by the government, as is wind power, electrical power, etc.

I'm tired of all this. I just want someone to become serious about providing adequate energy at an affordable price. I don't want any more 'government programs' that will be forgotten as soon as the tax breaks are expired.

I know I sound very cynical. Well, if I sound cynical it is probably because I am.

Allow me to raise your cynicism and add some pessimism: adequate energy will never be affordable, unless it becomes a competitively market-driven item. We're nowhere near that, so don't hold your breath.

I'm really in favor of more efficient vehicles, particularly all-electric cars. The Tesla roadster is very impressive...221 miles on a charge, 0-60 in 4 seconds, top speed of 125 mph. It's low-maintenance for 100k miles (change the fluids, except the oil, because there isn't any), it has few moving parts and is relatively simple. Electric engines are inherently more efficient than gasoline-driven ones, so plugging into the wall doesn't cost nearly as much as driving the same distance with gasoline. It gets the equivalent of 135 mpg.

A large vehicle like a truck could hold larger batteries, and there's no reason it couldn't work just as well. There's a rumor going around that Wal-Mart is actually considering selling electric or H cars in a few years. Lower fuel costs would be great for retailers - consumers could spend more money buying junk, transportation would become less expensive, and people could have larger vehicles to haul all that junk away in.

Even with electric cars though, the average monthly electric bill will still hover anywhere between $100 - 500 a month, depending on where one lives. Something drastic will have to happen to change that significantly.

 

[NDS]

That's pretty much the history of the world for you. Energy has always been expensive at some level - even if it takes some time to realize at what level that is. Now we're bearing more of the cost of our gasoline directly, rather than having so much of it subsidized. Biofuels are also heavily subsidized by the government, as is wind power, electrical power, etc.

Very true, part of our problem has been a glut through most of the 20th century that skewed our expectations.

Allow me to raise your cynicism and add some pessimism: adequate energy will never be affordable, unless it becomes a competitively market-driven item. We're nowhere near that, so don't hold your breath.

It's fusion--doncha know! But again, that miracle is just 20 years away--always. If you can figure out how to make as you describe you'll be revered and wealthy.

I'm really in favor of more efficient vehicles, particularly all-electric cars. The Tesla roadster is very impressive...221 miles on a charge, 0-60 in 4 seconds, top speed of 125 mph. It's low-maintenance for 100k miles (change the fluids, except the oil, because there isn't any), it has few moving parts and is relatively simple. Electric engines are inherently more efficient than gasoline-driven ones, so plugging into the wall doesn't cost nearly as much as driving the same distance with gasoline. It gets the equivalent of 135 mpg.
A large vehicle like a truck could hold larger batteries, and there's no reason it couldn't work just as well. There's a rumor going around that Wal-Mart is actually considering selling electric or H cars in a few years. Lower fuel costs would be great for retailers - consumers could spend more money buying junk, transportation would become less expensive, and people could have larger vehicles to haul all that junk away in.

Even with electric cars though, the average monthly electric bill will still hover anywhere between $100 - 500 a month, depending on where one lives. Something drastic will have to happen to change that significantly.

The problem with electric and hydrogen is the same. How do we make those? A short range electric car would be acceptable as a city commuter, but if you burn oil, coal, natural gas--you're adding an unnecessary step in the process and reducing efficiency. If we had gone to nuclear power for all (a majority) of our domestic electricity-- THEN hydrogen or electric might make sense.

You understand much of our current situation and the need for real development and investment in new sources. I'll still sit here expecting nothing new, different, or revolutionary until all other choices have been exhausted.

 

[DrDavidM]

I have to agree with Festus. If the media would just stop telling everyone how bad everything is perhaps they would go out and buy something. If they went out and bought something the economy would not be bad. Moral of the post. Do not listen to the media.

 

[Brainchild]

Well,let me first say that I nearly never listen to the media.I only watch the local news if there is something about my area or the company I work for in it,or becase the anchor chicks are hot.Second,I want to say that I am not any kind of expert on anything,but I am a member of several 12-step programs(just kidding).But I do have a few ideas and I THINK they will work,though I have not tried them yet.For electricity,I am thinking about a natural gas fueled generator.I kn,I know,natural gas is getting expensive,but the main constituent component of natural gas is methane.And you can make methane in your back yard.Also,a small windmill is not that difficult to build.I work in aviation and consequently I have a basic(VERY basic) working knowledge of physics and I know how they work,and if you use several of them to drive 12 volt alternators that charge a battery bank then run that through an inverter,you have cheap power.Solar is good,too,but still pretty expensive,as far as I know and if you can't afford it,it's useless to you.For fuel,there are several options.I have been seeing and hearing stuff about this water-4-gas thing,and one of the guys here at ExpressJet actually put it on his car and says he's getting outstanding gas mileage.I have seen several other bits of information and video clips about people who rean a car completely on water by separating it into hydrogen and oxygen using the car's battery.I have also been thinking about,and looking into using turpentine mixed with ethanol and a little bit of acetone.I know turpentine is more expensive than gasoline,but that's because not alot of people use it.It's made from pine trees.You just distill the sap.Again,I am not an expert,but these are some ideas.We don't have to go down.
Glory,glory Halleluia!

:i:

The more you know.

 

[DarrellM5]

The Tesla Roadster looks promising; but $100,000!!! My '04 diesel VW Jetta cost me $23,000 fully loaded. Even if diesel cost $5/gallon, I could drive it over 600,000 miles before my total cost was $100,000 (not including oil changes). They need to come up with a more affordable/justifiable solution.

 

[kwo51]

The oil companys have been buying the allturnatives to them for years. The upstarts need to be protected from being bought out to cover their progress into the future.

 

[toreskha]

The problem with electric and hydrogen is the same. How do we make those? A short range electric car would be acceptable as a city commuter, but if you burn oil, coal, natural gas--you're adding an unnecessary step in the process and reducing efficiency. If we had gone to nuclear power for all (a majority) of our domestic electricity-- THEN hydrogen or electric might make sense.

I'm all for nuclear and solar. I don't see where either of those have serious drawbacks that we aren't prepared to deal with. Solar is more than just inefficient purple panels; it can be used in a lot of different configurations that significantly increases its utility.

I heard about a recent proposal to build a large solar plant in Arizona. Basically there's an array of small mirrors powered by servos that acts as one giant mirror. They track the sun to provide the optimum amount of light available. They gather a LOT of light and magnify it into a very intense beam, which is directed at an array of pipes. Those pipes are transparent and have another pipe within them. The space between the pipes is a vacuum, to prevent the heat from escaping. Water runs through the middle pipe at very high speeds and when the light hits it, it is immediately vaporized and goes off to push a turbine. Since AZ has a great deal of sunlight and nothing to do with it, this is a very dependable source of power. Rough estimates show that gathering 100-sq miles of intense AZ light would power the entire US, as it is now (although that's probably without figuring in moving our energy needs for transportation from oil to electric).

So, I'm not suggesting that we put all our eggs in one basket - a single nuclear strike could eliminate our ability to keep the lights on - but it gives an idea as to how much potential solar really has. Nuclear is also great...it's incredibly safe for the most part, and the "waste" is no more radioactive than when it first went in. In fact, it could still be reused to generate more power.

You understand much of our current situation and the need for real development and investment in new sources. I'll still sit here expecting nothing new, different, or revolutionary until all other choices have been exhausted.

Or, until I get elected to Congress and can build the political capital needed to push the Omnibus Solar Panel Subsidzation and NFA Repealment Act through committee, two floor votes and get the Prez to sign it. The eco-freaks will get their solar, we'll get our guns and everyone will be happy. :sly:

 

[whiskey]

The oil companys have been buying the allturnatives to them for years. The upstarts need to be protected from being bought out to cover their progress into the future.

+1. I saw on the History channel that future archaeologists will refer to current times as "The Oil Age". Food for thought: In every great society throughout history, the wage despairity between the poor and rich continues to grow until a revolution occurs.

 

[kwo51]

Here in florida it's 381 cheeper to fill up on beer. BS is going to cause rioting if it is not stopped. Goverment insentive used to fill tanks of cars. BS BS BS When is it going to stop?

 

[kwo51]

3.82 here now.

 

[toreskha]

Here in florida it's 381 cheeper to fill up on beer. BS is going to cause rioting if it is not stopped. Goverment insentive used to fill tanks of cars. BS BS BS When is it going to stop?

They said people would go nuts when it went past $2/gallon, and there was a bunch of press coverage, but everyone accepted it. Everyone was supposed to go nuts at $3/gallon...same story. $4/gallon...it'll be the same story.

Some people are getting smaller cars, and the demand is encouraging a lot of research. However, it's highly unlikely that rioting would solve anything at all.

It seems like a huge increase but it's really not that big; I heard recently that the average American pays $700 extra per year to fund recent increases in gas prices. In most cases, if people gave up something they don't need anyway - like coffee or cable - that would almost pay for it. If you got a real estate license and sold one house a year, that would probably cover most of the annual gasoline for a medium-sized car.

 

[HK4U]

Like a frog in water

They said people would go nuts when it went past $2/gallon, and there was a bunch of press coverage, but everyone accepted it. Everyone was supposed to go nuts at $3/gallon...same story. $4/gallon...it'll be the same story.

Some people are getting smaller cars, and the demand is encouraging a lot of research. However, it's highly unlikely that rioting would solve anything at all.

It seems like a huge increase but it's really not that big; I heard recently that the average American pays $700 extra per year to fund recent increases in gas prices. In most cases, if people gave up something they don't need anyway - like coffee or cable - that would almost pay for it. If you got a real estate license and sold one house a year, that would probably cover most of the annual gasoline for a medium-sized car.

In most cases, if people gave up something they don't need anyway - like coffee or cable - that would almost pay for it.
Yes and if that is not enough perhaps we could give up food. Then when the price hits 10 dollars a gallon we can give up our houses and live on the streets.

 

[Scarecrow]

gas here was 3.99 the other day.

 

[toreskha]

Nah, my legs aren't that tasty.

Yes and if that is not enough perhaps we could give up food. Then when the price hits 10 dollars a gallon we can give up our houses and live on the streets.

By the time it hits $10/gallon, we had better have another plan in the tube. Otherwise it really will be prohibitively expensive, and there will be actual riots.

I'm a skeptic, though. How long have cars been around? Since the early 20th century. How long have people been around? A lot longer. We seemed to make do before cars or even the railroad, so they're not the only possible source of transportation.

Walking still hasn't gone out of style, and bicycling is practical, especially if you have the kind that fold up and you can put it in your car. Horses and donkeys will get you where you're going. You can also ride a cow or ox - they've been used for thousands of years to plow fields, pull wagons, etc. A golf cart with knobby tires can probably be set up with a roof-mounted solar panel. It might not be fast but it works!

Yep...if gas gets to be $10/gallon, I'm definitely moving back home to the woods and riding a horse (or cow, or whatever) around.