Friend and I are interested in the FNH 5.8. All comments I have seen make it out to be one of the best semi autos out there and certainly very lethal.Also like the idea that it uses a 20 round mag, which puts it into a very effective capacity category. Only concerns we both have is how it "feels" in your hand (large and small (posssibly for wife) and its recoil. We have not found any shops that have this firearm as a rental and we feel it is improper to ask to use same in a shop and then think about purchasing internet---the price difference is at leat $200 and that is a bit of money. Anyone have one of these and how does it compare say to a 38 revolver or a semi auto in the 9mm to 45 size?
FNH 5.8 Semi Auto
- Thread starter kelcarry
- Start date
I love it. Recoil about like a 22mag, maybe a little more. Loud and lots of muzzle flash though. I have pretty big hands so grip feels good, it's not much different than a Glock 21 or Sig 229. I like the arrangement of the safety also. Its right under your index finger with the correct grip. As for small hands I can't say, I may have to have wife or a friend test that one out. Some indoor ranges won't allow because of velocity. I like, but its a handgun, I like most all of them! I'm kinda on restriction after I brought this one home, Wife had said "NO MORE, You have enough". I traded a Sig and some cash for it so my overall number didn't go up. She didn't see it the same way!
I am going to assume you mean Five Seven which fires the 5.7 x 28 mm round. I have one, and I love it. It is my carry gun, and it is very concealable with the Crossbreed Supertuck. Holds 20+1 rounds, and you can get a 10 round extender if so desired (I didn't). Comes with three magazines. I like the way it feels in my hand though I do have a medium to large hand. Recoil is extremely small though there is a nice amount of muzzle flash, and is louder than other guns.
I also have several revolvers including a .38 special and .357 mag. MY S&W 442 when firing a 158 grain semi-wadcutter +P round has a lot more recoil than the FsN. I ended up getting different ammo because it was beating up my hand. I tried the same ammo in my S&W 681 without any problem at all. I like to say the FsN has the recoil of a .22 while the power of at least a 9mm.
Factory SS195LF and SS197SR ammo isn't bad. If you want specialized ammo, try Elite Ammunition as they have some great rounds for self defense, and more.
I found the FN 5.7 to be over rated. Ammo cost is high, performance in various mediums questionable. Recoil seemed to be similar to a .40 S&W, however performance was comparable to a .22 mag. Will shoot well on the range and on paper, however, shooting at various targets (glass windshield, steel car door, heavy winter clothing, etc.) I found the performance to be seriously lacking. Yes you do have a higher capacity magazine, however, you will need the extra rounds to accomplish the same result that you would normally get with a more common caliber like a 9mm or .40 S&W.
Selecting a firearm for personal protection is a very personal choice. If you ask a dozen people, you'll probably get at least the same number of responses. Some may love it, others won't.
Selecting a firearm for personal protection is a very personal choice. If you ask a dozen people, you'll probably get at least the same number of responses. Some may love it, others won't.
Well apparently you have never shot one for real. I find no truth in any of your comments(except the one about getting 12 different responses). Trust me, I might know what I am talking about on this subject.
You compare it to a .22 mag??? are you fricking nuts. I am a 45acp man personally, but I do own one of these and have put about 3,000(sorry typo/not 6k but 3k) rounds down range with it. All credible balistic data I have seen puts it well above a 9mm and about on par with a 45acp(with the correct ammo). I consistently hit 7 out of 10 clay pigeons at 50yds(yes that is yards). You have a necked down 223 rifle round in a pistol. The gun is putting a 40gr projectile at over 2000fps. The wound path has more than proven itself fatal.
As for ammo cost, I usually get it around $18 a box of 50. Quality ammo, made by 2 companies. Not cheap walmart crap you take to the range. What do you pay for your carry ammo? $20 to $30 a box of 25?
The only reason it is not my CC gun is it is too big and I am all about concealment. I carry a SW 360pd in 357mag.
This is using protector ammo, but most people use the best ammo than can find for their carry anyways.
Link Removed
You compare it to a .22 mag??? are you fricking nuts. I am a 45acp man personally, but I do own one of these and have put about 3,000(sorry typo/not 6k but 3k) rounds down range with it. All credible balistic data I have seen puts it well above a 9mm and about on par with a 45acp(with the correct ammo). I consistently hit 7 out of 10 clay pigeons at 50yds(yes that is yards). You have a necked down 223 rifle round in a pistol. The gun is putting a 40gr projectile at over 2000fps. The wound path has more than proven itself fatal.
As for ammo cost, I usually get it around $18 a box of 50. Quality ammo, made by 2 companies. Not cheap walmart crap you take to the range. What do you pay for your carry ammo? $20 to $30 a box of 25?
The only reason it is not my CC gun is it is too big and I am all about concealment. I carry a SW 360pd in 357mag.
This is using protector ammo, but most people use the best ammo than can find for their carry anyways.
Link Removed
MIL-SPEC 45
Banned
I enjoy mine its lightweight high capacity spits out rounds fast on target recoil is about .32 acp !!!!!! Very accurate if need be punches straight through bulletproof vest both sides what else can be said about it and for those of you said it doesn't work try telling that to the families who lost loved one's at the tragedy at FORT HOOD!!!!
Valorius
New member
FN ammo can be had for $20 a box of 50rds, and is useable for hunting or self defense, not just plinking.
Seems rather cheap to me, honestly.
Depends on the load. Top Elite and FN SS192/198 loads are extremely effective barrier penetrators, will blow right through soft body armor, and yet still blow through 12+" of bare gel.
I must question if you even fired a Five SeveN at all. Recoil is more like a .22 mag than a .40 S&W. The Five SeveN, even with the hottest loads, has very little recoil at all.
As far as terminal effects, Brassfetcher labs gel tested the Elite S4 round and stated as follows in the summarized report:
"As tested, both 5.7x28mm cartridges (Elite S4M and Elite Protector II) offer lethality that is on par or slightly greater then a .45 ACP 230gr Jacketed Hollowpoint. (Round shown was the Federal 230gr Hydrashok JHP)."
It further states:
"Conversely, the FN SS192/5 and Elite ammunition S4M offer performance quite similar to the tested .45 ACP, with considerably lower recoil and ammunition weight, coupled with a significantly higher magazine capacity.
We feel that the S4M can be viewed as a "+P" version of very effective SS192/95 27.5gr, and we have no qualms about recommending this cartridge as a feasible replacement to the more conventional .45 ACP handgun, for use against human attackers."
Link Removed mmary.pdf
Here is video of an S4 gel test:
Seriously, you are making completely unsupportable claims in your post.
You meant the FN 5.7 right? I haven't been able to find one listed as the FN5.8 although BlackHawk! Does list a Serpa for the "5.8"
Hey fudo: Just read your comment on preferred KT PMR-30. When you read up on the KT, they describe it as "good for target shooting and small game". Yes it has a 30 round capacity and it is a heck of a lot cheaper than the FN5.7 but what makes you so sure, in your opinion, that they are equivalent or that the 30 is better? Have you actually shot the FN or actually compared it on the range to the PMR30? I believe, just based on overall reviews that FN and KT are on different quality/construction/operational levels. I never see a description of an FN5.7 that says it is good for small game--the usual words and reviews on the 5.7 are it is very good, reliable, and well made at short and long distances. I would love to save money and get max bang/buck and I would appreciate any further comments you may have about the KT PMR30 that can convince me that it is the equivalent of an FN5.7. I do not own one but am considering having something that has high capacity and intend it for basically home defense at distances within 20 yards where a hit or multiple hits will end any problems immediately. I do have an HD shotgun with 18 inch barrel and want to supplement it with an easy to handle high capacity handgun to replace my 38, which is extremely reliable like most revolvers are, but will give me capacity that will guarantee me many accurate good final shots if, g-d forbid, it is necessary, particularly, IMO, in the current "climate of change" our vaunted king with no clothes is taking us to.
PS: After I wrote the above, I checked comments on the PMR30 and KT now has a recall going for problems. Many comments talk about "failures to fire". All you need is one misfire--30 cartridges will mean nothing then. Confidence, if this is "the firearm to have" does not seem to be in the same ballpark with my shotgun, my 38 or what I read about the FN5.7. Your comments on all of what I have written would be most welcome. The idea of spending $1000, even if it shoots all the time, seems a bit high if there are others out there that will not misfire, which is giving me some cause for concern with the PMR30.
PS: After I wrote the above, I checked comments on the PMR30 and KT now has a recall going for problems. Many comments talk about "failures to fire". All you need is one misfire--30 cartridges will mean nothing then. Confidence, if this is "the firearm to have" does not seem to be in the same ballpark with my shotgun, my 38 or what I read about the FN5.7. Your comments on all of what I have written would be most welcome. The idea of spending $1000, even if it shoots all the time, seems a bit high if there are others out there that will not misfire, which is giving me some cause for concern with the PMR30.
fudo
New member
I would choose the KT over the FN for several reasons. The KT is roughly $400, as opposed to roughly $1000. Ammunition for the KT is vastly cheaper and more readily available than the 5.7. The KT small parts are also cheaper, and they are simple to work on.
I have handled both guns, but not shot either one. I think that the FN is the better weapon, especially if the military and police rounds are available, but 2 1/2 times better? And twice as expensive to shoot? My answer is no, your priorities may be different.
I have handled both guns, but not shot either one. I think that the FN is the better weapon, especially if the military and police rounds are available, but 2 1/2 times better? And twice as expensive to shoot? My answer is no, your priorities may be different.
Hey fudo: There is one major priority that we both can agree on--will the firearm fire when I want it to and will it continue to fire if I need it to. That, to me, and I cannot believe that you disagree, is priority one. Without that happening, I might as well have a rock in my hand. I agree with you on price and I agree with you that if it functions 100%, the KT can defend my home under the constraints that I am willing to live with (I have no interest in knowing that I can hit a bullseye at 50-100 yards without bullet decline and have no interest in knowing that I can penetrate body armor at 10 yards or greater). I am in my house, someone is crawling around, I am fearing for my life and I want capacity, and multiple shots so I can assure myself that I will hit the perp and hurt him, and a feeling that the firearm will bring this nightmare to a conclusion. I also want to be proficient with its use without going broke over hundreds of rounds of practice ammunition. BUT WILL IT WORK WHEN I NEED IT TO? I surely hope that KT can supply me with the kind of confidence I need in this product. Maybe their latest problems will solve all their problems. PS: I own a KT P3AT that has never caused me a bit of problem over countless hundreds of rounds of practice.
Thanks for your replies and sounding board for my concerns.
Thanks for your replies and sounding board for my concerns.
Valorius
New member
For defense?
This is a direct apple to apple comparison:
Kel Tec PMR-30, advertised velocity with Winchester 40gr HP: 1230fps, 134 ft-lbs energy.
FN Five SeveN, advertised velocity with Elite 40gr V-max Ballistic tip JHP: 2090fps, 390 ft-lbs energy.
So let's see....the Five Seven has about 70-80% more velocity, a far superior streamlined spitzer type V-max bullet, and just shy of TRIPLE the muzzle energy. On top of that, the Five SeveN uses extremely reliable rimless center fire ammunition, whereas the PMR-30 uses less reliable rimmed rimfire ammuniton.
These two pistols are not even remotely comparable as defensive tools. The PMR-30 is a neat-o range or plinking toy. The FN FsN is a 21st century war fighting tool capable of defeating even Class IIIA body armor with any of a variety of civilian legal rounds.
I have personally shot FN SS192 through 48 layers of Kevlar in tests. That is the rough equivalent to shooting through both sides of a Level IIIA vest.
How much does a box of 50rds of premium .22 magnum hunting ammunition cost? Because i can get a box of 50rds of premium FN SS197SR 40gr Vmax for $20 bucks online.
BTW, i do own an FN Five SeveN USG model. I have owned numerous top end high quality firearms (HK's, Sigs, Berettas, Colts, you name it), and IMO, the Five SeveN firing hot Elite ammo is in a league of it's own with regard to it's combat effectiveness.
Hey Valorius: Appreciate your comments backed up by facts and figures. Looking at the "standard" 5.7 cartridge, I had reservations about what exactly it could do from a HD/SD standpoint. Looking at your comments re Elite and following up with due diligence, it becomes evident that Elite has a package that is extremely potent for HD/SD. What really intrigued me about the 5.7 is the low recoil vs its lethality with high capacity that IMO cannot be matched with any other handgun out there. It was the last 2 factors that had me think about the PMR30 but it just seems no matter how you try to convince yourself, a 22mag is still a 22 and the PMR's reliability on every shot seems to be an issue that will never go away given rimfire design. Are there any other handguns out there that have elements of all three of my priorities (low recoil, lethality and high capacity) with reliability (a must for SD/HD) or does this come down to the "you get what you pay for". PS: I intend to use such a handgun for SD/HD (not CC but in the home--I know I will not CC a big gun--I have a small 380, which I do CC) at less than 10 yards. I cannot envision, given my lifestyle and abilities, for its use at anything more than that. Given that limitation as probably a 100% certainty, which sights are more in line with my thinking? My answer at this point are the fixed tactical and not the adjustable. Do you agree? I really want to thank you for your comments--they have been very helpful. Cudos to Randy, as well. Thanks guys. This is what this forum is all about.
Valorius
New member
Besides the FN FsN (abbreviation for the Five SeveN), there are only 2 other PDW chambered pistols that i am aware of.
One is the cancelled HK UCP (Ultimate Combat Pistol), chambered for 4.6x30mm.
The other is the Chinese Army's 5.8mm DAP 92 pistol.
Obviously, neither one is available, so the FN FsN is literally the only pistol on earth that can do what it can do.
The FN ammo is much weaker than the Elite stuff, however, at Fort Hood, the terrorist used FN SS192 ammo (28gr OTM @ 2100fps) to great effect, achieving 4 separate instant stops against 2 US troops (both attacked him at close range with chairs/tables when the terrorist first opened fire), a US cop (Ofc Munley), and an orderly.
Elite loads the same bullet that the SS192 uses, but to a much higher velocity.
Here is the dirt on the 28gr OTM loadings. All velocities listed for FsN pistol, and all rounds use the same 27.5gr aluminum core jacketed OTM design. I posted a link to gel tests for it in one of my previous posts in this thread.
FN SS192: 2100fps
FN SS195 white box: 2100fps
FN SS195LF blue box: 1900fps (watered down post Fort Hood ammo)
FN SS198 LE/Mil only: 2200fps
Elite S4M: 2600fps
The only other FN round is the SS197SR sporting round, a 40gr Vmax at about 1700fps
Elite loads the same 40gr Vmax to almost 2100fps.
Elite also loads several other very hot "+P" offerings in 5.7mm as well.
Glad i could help. Buy a Five SeveN, you won't regret it.
One is the cancelled HK UCP (Ultimate Combat Pistol), chambered for 4.6x30mm.
The other is the Chinese Army's 5.8mm DAP 92 pistol.
Obviously, neither one is available, so the FN FsN is literally the only pistol on earth that can do what it can do.
The FN ammo is much weaker than the Elite stuff, however, at Fort Hood, the terrorist used FN SS192 ammo (28gr OTM @ 2100fps) to great effect, achieving 4 separate instant stops against 2 US troops (both attacked him at close range with chairs/tables when the terrorist first opened fire), a US cop (Ofc Munley), and an orderly.
Elite loads the same bullet that the SS192 uses, but to a much higher velocity.
Here is the dirt on the 28gr OTM loadings. All velocities listed for FsN pistol, and all rounds use the same 27.5gr aluminum core jacketed OTM design. I posted a link to gel tests for it in one of my previous posts in this thread.
FN SS192: 2100fps
FN SS195 white box: 2100fps
FN SS195LF blue box: 1900fps (watered down post Fort Hood ammo)
FN SS198 LE/Mil only: 2200fps
Elite S4M: 2600fps
The only other FN round is the SS197SR sporting round, a 40gr Vmax at about 1700fps
Elite loads the same 40gr Vmax to almost 2100fps.
Elite also loads several other very hot "+P" offerings in 5.7mm as well.
Glad i could help. Buy a Five SeveN, you won't regret it.
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