Duty to notify amendment?

AndeyHall

Active member
Why hasn't anyone brought up this issue yet? I mean I think this is a huge problem considering A LOT of officers overreact when they find out you have a gun. I refuse to have my gun on me in my vehicle because of this law. I think it should be tackled right along with restaurant, school, and constitution carry.
 
That is a fine suggestion to bring up to your elected representative. It's on my list to discuss later in the year.

Any duty to notify is dumb, especially in SC's case where it is limited to the CHP, and has nothing to do with the weapon.
 
out of the things you listed, i'd be worried about the duty to notify the least.
I don't worry about anything "least". If it violates the 2nd amendment (or any constitutional material for that matter) it's of equal concern to me as anything else.
 
I mean look at that guy in Florida. His gun became visible once he bent over his seat to retrieve his l&r. If FL's wording is anything like SC, "under normal wear of clothing" which covers his situation, then there is absolutely no excuse for an officer to act the way he did and be ignorant of the law in which it is his job to uphold. I myself have been victim to a situation just like this and spent a night in jail because of it. That officer no longer works for Anderson City PD. And I didn't even go jumping out of my car like the FL guy did. The cop told me (not ask, TOLD) that I had been drinking (which I had not) simply because I was changing the station on the radio and swerved briefly. He then asked to search the vehicle (which I have since learned to never let them do) and found my pistol in the center console. Turns out he had heard about the duty to notify part of the CWP laws and thought it applied to everyone with a gun. Despite his ignorance of the law, the biggest issue was that he had me in his crosshairs once he was so confident I was intoxicated and then found out he was wrong. Guess it didn't play on his ego very well.
 
Silly guy, COPS are above the law.

You must not be blinded by the media :)

Not like there's not a thousand videos on YouTube that shows video evidence of police corruption. Don't get me wrong, there are some good apples, but the barrel has a lot of rotten ones.
 
Why hasn't anyone brought up this issue yet? I mean I think this is a huge problem considering A LOT of officers overreact when they find out you have a gun. I refuse to have my gun on me in my vehicle because of this law. I think it should be tackled right along with restaurant, school, and constitution carry.

So if you don't have your gun on you in your vehicle, where do you keep it? In the glove compartment with your registration? If so, that could end up ugly?
 
Why hasn't anyone brought up this issue yet? I mean I think this is a huge problem considering A LOT of officers overreact when they find out you have a gun. I refuse to have my gun on me in my vehicle because of this law. I think it should be tackled right along with restaurant, school, and constitution carry.

So if you don't have your gun on you in your vehicle, where do you keep it? In the glove compartment with your registration? If so, that could end up ugly?
My truck has a transparent slot in the visor for my registration and insurance. I have a .45 1911 that is ALWAYS in the center console and my carry gun is also in there with it when I'm driving. I can actually get to them faster there than I can if it's on my side. But I don't put them in the glove box cause that's just too far away and too hard to get to.

But one of my professors at Clemson who is licensed to practice law in SC actually advised me to go to SLED's website and print out their gun laws and highlight all the sections that a cop may call you out on or be ignorant of and keep it in your car somewhere. So I have the CWP school exemption highlighted in case campus PD ever tries to say I can't have a gun on campus, and I also have the section highlighted saying you only have to notify if the gun is on your person.
 
What does this mean?

In SC a permitted concealed carrier is required by law, if carrying a concealed weapon, to "inform a law enforcement officer of the fact that he is a permit holder and present the permit identification card when an officer (1) identifies himself as a law enforcement officer and (2) requests identification or a driver's license from a permit holder." You are not required to notify the officer that you have a weapon. Kinda dumb right?

South Carolina Legislature Mobile
 
In SC a permitted concealed carrier is required by law, if carrying a concealed weapon, to "inform a law enforcement officer of the fact that he is a permit holder and present the permit identification card when an officer (1) identifies himself as a law enforcement officer and (2) requests identification or a driver's license from a permit holder." You are not required to notify the officer that you have a weapon. Kinda dumb right?

South Carolina Legislature Mobile

But you're not required to notify of the permit if you don't have a gun.....so isn't it kind of a given that if you're notifying of a permit then obviously you have a weapon?
 
But you're not required to notify of the permit if you don't have a gun.....so isn't it kind of a given that if you're notifying of a permit then obviously you have a weapon?

Perhaps, but you asked what I meant by what I said, and that's it. I read the law and follow it without worrying about other's interpretation.

Regardless, if the goal is that a LEO is aware of the presence of a gun, then why not just write the law properly compelling the gun carrier to inform that he is carrying a gun (which would be even worse that the current law)? Either way, once the CWP is turned over, the duty to notify is completed.

Any duty to notify is dumb and provides no value whatsoever. It's on the list to get rid of (at least for me).
 
But you're not required to notify of the permit if you don't have a gun.....so isn't it kind of a given that if you're notifying of a permit then obviously you have a weapon?
Well... No! A lot of people are told by their CWP instructors, the local cop or internet lawyers on forums such as this one that if they possess a CWP that they have to notify/show it to a cop if they have any interaction with them. And that information is wrong on two counts.
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First, if you're not carrying at all (and why would you do that?) or if you aren't carrying pursuant to your CWP you don't have to produce your CWP. Examples of not having to notify because you're not carrying pursuant to is if you're pulled over by a cop while driving and your gun is in one of the designated "safe" areas in your vehicle or if a cop wants to "see some ID" while you're on your own property. That second example brings up other civil rights issues that I won't go into on a firearms forum.
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Secondly, 23-31-215(K) tells us you only have to notify/produce your CWP if the cop identifies himself as law enforcement (being in uniform is considered sufficient notification) and he requests identification. If both criteria are not met you don't have to tell them diddly squat. So you can hang around at the donut shop all day long talking to cops, and unless one of them has probable cause to ask for your ID you don't have to notify.
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I know I'm over simplifying this but I know for a fact that some folks still either won't or don't want to get it.
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Finally, in any interaction you have with the law, the best thing you can do is keep your mouth shut. In South Carolina you are under no legal requirement to answer any questions or to allow them to search yourself or your property without either reasonable articulable suspicion (PC) or a warrant. And if a cop asks you to see some ID, and if you are carrying pursuant to, don't blurt out "I have a gun". Simply hand them your CWP and shut up. Remember, you have the right to remain silent, make sure you have the ability...
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23-31-215(K) - A permit holder must have his permit identification card in his possession whenever he carries a concealable weapon. When carrying a concealable weapon pursuant to Article 4 of Chapter 31 of Title 23, a permit holder must inform a law enforcement officer of the fact that he is a permit holder and present the permit identification card when an officer (1) identifies himself as a law enforcement officer and (2) requests identification or a driver's license from a permit holder. A permit holder immediately must report the loss or theft of a permit identification card to SLED headquarters. A person who violates the provisions of this subsection is guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, must be fined twenty-five dollars.
 
But you're not required to notify of the permit if you don't have a gun.....so isn't it kind of a given that if you're notifying of a permit then obviously you have a weapon?
Well... No! A lot of people are told by their CWP instructors, the local cop or internet lawyers on forums such as this one that if they possess a CWP that they have to notify/show it to a cop if they have any interaction with them. And that information is wrong on two counts.
.
First, if you're not carrying at all (and why would you do that?) or if you aren't carrying pursuant to your CWP you don't have to produce your CWP. Examples of not having to notify because you're not carrying pursuant to is if you're pulled over by a cop while driving and your gun is in one of the designated "safe" areas in your vehicle or if a cop wants to "see some ID" while you're on your own property. That second example brings up other civil rights issues that I won't go into on a firearms forum.
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Secondly, 23-31-215(K) tells us you only have to notify/produce your CWP if the cop identifies himself as law enforcement (being in uniform is considered sufficient notification) and he requests identification. If both criteria are not met you don't have to tell them diddly squat. So you can hang around at the donut shop all day long talking to cops, and unless one of them has probable cause to ask for your ID you don't have to notify.
.
I know I'm over simplifying this but I know for a fact that some folks still either won't or don't want to get it.
.
Finally, in any interaction you have with the law, the best thing you can do is keep your mouth shut. In South Carolina you are under no legal requirement to answer any questions or to allow them to search yourself or your property without either reasonable articulable suspicion (PC) or a warrant. And if a cop asks you to see some ID, and if you are carrying pursuant to, don't blurt out "I have a gun". Simply hand them your CWP and shut up. Remember, you have the right to remain silent, make sure you have the ability...
.
.
23-31-215(K) - A permit holder must have his permit identification card in his possession whenever he carries a concealable weapon. When carrying a concealable weapon pursuant to Article 4 of Chapter 31 of Title 23, a permit holder must inform a law enforcement officer of the fact that he is a permit holder and present the permit identification card when an officer (1) identifies himself as a law enforcement officer and (2) requests identification or a driver's license from a permit holder. A permit holder immediately must report the loss or theft of a permit identification card to SLED headquarters. A person who violates the provisions of this subsection is guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, must be fined twenty-five dollars.
So not informing that you have a CWP is the same thing as not wearing a seatbelt? If that's the case, I'll take the fine!
 
So not informing that you have a CWP is the same thing as not wearing a seatbelt? If that's the case, I'll take the fine!
Well yeah. But not really. The fine is only $25. But it goes on your record as a weapons conviction. What happens to your CWP and your ability to buy a new gun (think 4473) if you have a weapons conviction on your record?
 
So not informing that you have a CWP is the same thing as not wearing a seatbelt? If that's the case, I'll take the fine!
Well yeah. But not really. The fine is only $25. But it goes on your record as a weapons conviction. What happens to your CWP and your ability to buy a new gun (think 4473) if you have a weapons conviction on your record?
Actually, I have a question about that. According to federal law you lose your 2nd amendment rights when charged with a felony only, not a misdemeanor. Therefore if I lose my permit because of a misdemeanor, South Carolina would be denying me my 2nd amendment right to bear arms. So would revoking someone's permit for something other than a felony not be unconstitutional. And further, lets say you have a lower class single mom or dad who works 7 days a week, struggles to make ends meat and never has a dime or time to spare. So taking the time or money to take a concealed weapons class is out of the question, but he or she wants to carry for their protection. That, to mr, is a violation of the 2nd amendment. SC has a lot of thinking to do on their gun laws is all I can say, and I don't care how liberal we are compared to other states.
 
Why hasn't anyone brought up this issue yet? I mean I think this is a huge problem considering A LOT of officers overreact when they find out you have a gun. I refuse to have my gun on me in my vehicle because of this law. I think it should be tackled right along with restaurant, school, and constitution carry.


Sounds like an issue in your particular state. Here in VA the cops see our permits when they run our plates and it's never an issue. I can't see it being one unless your in an anti state. We can also carry in restaurants, bars etc. Also in school parking lots (in vehicle). As far as you not carrying because you MIGHT get pulled over and MIGHT have a cop that over reacts, that's a little crazy.
 
Sounds like an issue in your particular state. Here in VA the cops see our permits when they run our plates and it's never an issue. I can't see it being one unless your in an anti state. We can also carry in restaurants, bars etc. Also in school parking lots. As far as you not carrying because you MIGHT get pulled over and MIGHT have a cop that over reacts, that's a little crazy.

it is...that's why it's in the SC section...
 
Why hasn't anyone brought up this issue yet? I mean I think this is a huge problem considering A LOT of officers overreact when they find out you have a gun. I refuse to have my gun on me in my vehicle because of this law. I think it should be tackled right along with restaurant, school, and constitution carry.


Sounds like an issue in your particular state. Here in VA the cops see our permits when they run our plates and it's never an issue. I can't see it being one unless your in an anti state. We can also carry in restaurants, bars etc. Also in school parking lots (in vehicle). As far as you not carrying because you MIGHT get pulled over and MIGHT have a cop that over reacts, that's a little crazy.
I didn't say I wasn't carrying period, I just said I don't carry when driving. And also, I don't carry while driving for 2 reasons: 1) if you wear a seat belt then it's easier to get it out of the center console than off your side, and 2) because I HAVE been bulled over and HAVE had an officer overreact, not MIGHT. On 2 separate occasions I have been pulled over, gave the officer my CWP, he asked me to step out of the car and he patted me down and took my gun while he conducted his traffic stop. Knowing what I know now about officers' rights to search me and my vehicle, all he would have gotten out of me after asking me to step out of my car was "kiss my ass."
 

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