discharge of fire arm and lawsuits?

[creatism]

Anyone know if Colorado is like ky or ok, in that in those 2 states you are immune from civil suits if you are justified in defending your life?

 

[WAJ]

As a CO resident and, having gone through my CCW class sometime back, I was told we are, however certainly something that I would seek confirmation on with the "powers that be."

 

[creatism]

Thank you, my fiancé wants to live there at some point. Do I've been looking through the laws to see, and they are about as clear as mud!

 

[Skiluvr03]

See if you have "Castle Doctrine" and "Stand your Ground" or aka, make my day laws

 

[grizzerr]

In Colorado the Castle Doctrine (CRS 18-1-704.5) is actually called "The Make My Day Law" and does provide immunity from criminal prosecution and civil suits.
Link Removed

 

[WAJ]

It was my understanding via a lawyer in our CCW class that the stand your ground law was change so you now can stand your grounds. There are also additional legal protections for the disable and the elderly. something, in regards to defending themselves....Something I'll look into further.

Colorado does have castle doctrine meaning we are backed up by law in defending our houses against intruders, but we do not have a stand your ground law. We are required to exhaust every other amount of force before using lethal force, aka, if you can run, you have to run.

Protection from civil suits? I have no idea.

 

[50SR9]

I seriously doubt in today's society that you can be immune from any suit. Now whether the suit will have any validity remains to be said. I know of a case where a woman ran off the highway in her car, through a fence, across a section of property, into a pond and drowned. The landowner was sued for liability. I do not know the out come of the suit. But just shows to go ya!. Granted Ok's castle doctrine and stand your ground law will definitely weigh in your favor.

 

[grizzerr]

As far as I know, there is no stand your ground law in this state. Remember that in CRS, to be legally justified in using deadly force, you are required to have have exhausted all other options.



So if you can run away, you are required to run away.

Really? Where in the statute do you read that?

18-1-704. Use of physical force in defense of a person.
Except as provided in subsections (2) and (3) of this section, a person is justified in using physical force upon another person in order to defend himself or a third person from what he reasonably believes to be the use of imminent use of unlawful physical force by that other person, and he may use a degree of force which he reasonably believes to be necessary for that purpose.

Deadly physical force may be used only if a person reasonably believes a lesser degree of force is inadequate and:
The actor has reasonable ground to believe and does believe, that he or another person is in imminent danger of being killed or of receiving great bodily injury; or
The other person is using or reasonably appears about to use physical force against an occupant of a dwelling or business establishment while committing or attempting to commit burglary as defined in sections 18-4-202 to 18-4-204; or
The other person is committing or reasonably appears about to commit kidnapping as defined in section 18-3-301 or 18-3-302, robbery as defined in section 18-4-301 or 18-4-302, sexual assault as set forth in section 18-3-402 or in section 18-3-403 as it existed prior to July 1, 2000, or assault as defined in sections 18-3-202 and 18-3-203.

I see no where that it says you have to attempt to escape, only that deadly force is allowed if a lesser degree of force is inadequate. I don't see where running away/escaping is a "lesser degree of force". No lawyer or prosecutor I've ever spoken to has ever interpreted it that way either. I teach students to avoid a fight if possible but once the assault is initiated don't turn your bag on the assailant.

 

[Deserteagle]

Really? Where in the statute do you read that?

18-1-704. Use of physical force in defense of a person.
Except as provided in subsections (2) and (3) of this section, a person is justified in using physical force upon another person in order to defend himself or a third person from what he reasonably believes to be the use of imminent use of unlawful physical force by that other person, and he may use a degree of force which he reasonably believes to be necessary for that purpose.

Deadly physical force may be used only if a person reasonably believes a lesser degree of force is inadequate and:
The actor has reasonable ground to believe and does believe, that he or another person is in imminent danger of being killed or of receiving great bodily injury; or
The other person is using or reasonably appears about to use physical force against an occupant of a dwelling or business establishment while committing or attempting to commit burglary as defined in sections 18-4-202 to 18-4-204; or
The other person is committing or reasonably appears about to commit kidnapping as defined in section 18-3-301 or 18-3-302, robbery as defined in section 18-4-301 or 18-4-302, sexual assault as set forth in section 18-3-402 or in section 18-3-403 as it existed prior to July 1, 2000, or assault as defined in sections 18-3-202 and 18-3-203.

I see no where that it says you have to attempt to escape, only that deadly force is allowed if a lesser degree of force is inadequate. I don't see where running away/escaping is a "lesser degree of force". No lawyer or prosecutor I've ever spoken to has ever interpreted it that way either. I teach students to avoid a fight if possible but once the assault is initiated don't turn your bag on the assailant.

It's common sense to walk away from a fight if you can. The law requires us to have no lesser degree of force available. If you are going to be a tough guy, good for you. Lets just hope the jury thinks you are golden when you decided to take a life rather than walk away from the aggressor.

My firearm is my last option. Im no tough guy, Im just a person looking to go home at the end of the day. If somebody threatens my life, I do everything I can reasonably do to get out of that situation with no loss of life. If you disagree with that, that's your problem.

And P.S. the law makers will not, and cannot spell out for you every example of what a lesser degree of force means. You have to use common sense. Using your legs to walk out of there is a lesser degree of force in my opinion, and I am planning on the jury agreeing.

Officer: So he started walking towards you from across the parking lot holding a golf club correct?
You: Yes.
Officer: And you decided to stand there and wait for him to get close to you?
You: Yep.
Officer: And you figured you would just watch him come at you and then shoot him 5 times once he got closer to you rather than start walking/running away from him while calling 911?
You: Ya. I mean come on, I wasnt going to give up and run away like a pansy. Ill get called a sissy by the guys at work. And plus, if this guy has beef with me, I'll show him I got beef too. And I sure as heck didn't want to have to give up my favorite place to stand on the sidewalk.

That doesn't make much sense does it?
This does though:

Officer: Thanks for calling us, is this the man you saw walking at you from across the parking lot with a golf club?
Me: Yes that's him.
Officer: Explain to me what you did.
Me: Well he was yelling at me and went to his car and I saw him pull out a golf club and start walking towards me from across the parking lot, so I ran into this McDonalds and had them call 911 because I think he was planning on hurting me, and the last thing I want to do is have to use lethal force to defend myself. So I figured I would call you guys while I still could and let you deal with him.

 

[WAJ]

Beg to differ.....

As of 2009 it was passed....

States that have a Stand Your Ground law in effect.

Idaho
Arizona
Alaska - Passed, but not yet signed.
Colorado
North Dakota
South Dakota
Minnesota
Kansas
Oklahoma
Mossouri
Louisiana
Michigan
Indiana
Ohio
Kentucky
Mississippi
Alabama
Georgia
Florida
South Carolina
Pennsylvania
Virgina

It's common sense to walk away from a fight if you can. The law requires us to have no lesser degree of force available. If you are going to be a tough guy, good for you. Lets just hope the jury thinks you are golden when you decided to take a life rather than walk away from the aggressor.

My firearm is my last option. Im no tough guy, Im just a person looking to go home at the end of the day. If somebody threatens my life, I do everything I can reasonably do to get out of that situation with no loss of life. If you disagree with that, that's your problem.

And P.S. the law makers will not, and cannot spell out for you every example of what a lesser degree of force means. You have to use common sense. Using your legs to walk out of there is a lesser degree of force in my opinion, and I am planning on the jury agreeing.

Officer: So he started walking towards you from across the parking lot holding a golf club correct?
You: Yes.
Officer: And you decided to stand there and wait for him to get close to you?
You: Yep.
Officer: And you figured you would just watch him come at you and then shoot him 5 times once he got closer to you rather than start walking/running away from him while calling 911?
You: Ya. I mean come on, I wasnt going to give up and run away like a pansy. Ill get called a sissy by the guys at work. And plus, if this guy has beef with me, I'll show him I got beef too. And I sure as heck didn't want to have to give up my favorite place to stand on the sidewalk.

That doesn't make much sense does it?
This does though:

Officer: Thanks for calling us, is this the man you saw walking at you from across the parking lot with a golf club?
Me: Yes that's him.
Officer: Explain to me what you did.
Me: Well he was yelling at me and went to his car and I saw him pull out a golf club and start walking towards me from across the parking lot, so I ran into this McDonalds and had them call 911 because I think he was planning on hurting me, and the last thing I want to do is have to use lethal force to defend myself. So I figured I would call you guys while I still could and let you deal with him.

Sorry but Colorado is not a "Stand your ground" law state.

 

[Deserteagle]

As of 2009 it was passed....

States that have a Stand Your Ground law in effect.

Idaho
Arizona
Alaska - Passed, but not yet signed.
Colorado
North Dakota
South Dakota
Minnesota
Kansas
Oklahoma
Mossouri
Louisiana
Michigan
Indiana
Ohio
Kentucky
Mississippi
Alabama
Georgia
Florida
South Carolina
Pennsylvania
Virgina

Did some more research and found 2 interesting cases

There is no statutory provision regarding the duty of a person to retreat before countering the use of force with force. The doctrine derives from the common law. People v. Watson, 671 P.2d 973 (Colo. App. 1983).

So there is nothing in the law saying we are required to retreat.

The defendant, if he did not provoke the assault, is not obliged to retreat or flee to save his life, but may stand his ground, and even, in some circumstances, pursue his assailant until the latter has been disarmed or disabled from carrying into effect his unlawful purpose, and this right of the defendant goes even to the extent, if necessary, of taking human life. Boykin v. People, 22 Colo. 496, 45 P. 419 (1896); Enyart v. People, 67 Colo. 434, 180 P. 722 (1919)

However this is 1896 and 1919 and not 2009. I would still choose to retreat from a situation first since the law does not explicitly state we are required to retreat, but there is a possibility that a jury might rule otherwise, saying retreating is a lesser degree of force as required in CRS 18-1-704

 

[grizzerr]

I just got back to the thread, but it appears you've already what I was going to post.

I agree it's always better to avoid the fight when possible. It seems where we differ is that you define and assault and a threat of an assault as the same thing. The threat would fall under the menacing statute and there is no provision for defensive physical force.
Your parking lot scenario is just that, a case of menacing and no I wouldn't stand there and wait for the bad guy to get to me either. Of course that's not the same thing as the bad guy being bad breath distance from me and physically attacking me with the bat. Is my life in danger? Yes! Am I justified in using deadly force? Yes! Respond accordingly and repeat as necessary.

By the way I don't consider myself a tough guy, but I am dangerous when the situation arises and teach my students to be the same.

 

[gsim]

I was told by my CCW instructor, also a police officer, that you were protected civilly from defending yourself from the BGs, but you were responsible for every bullet out of your gun. So if a stray shot goes and hits a bystander it can come back to you, but a stickup guys family isn't going to be coming after you for lost wages. I wouldn't bank on one officers opinion/perception, but I'll believe it for now.