DC: Police to seal off city


festus

God Bless Our Troops!!!
Papers Please

Herr Meister...Your Papers are not in order! step ziz vay please.

How much more before people riot in the streets?:angry2:
 

WaltherCC

New member
It's a little misleading to have addressed this thread as "Police to seal off city," that's a blatant exaggeration. What they're actually doing is tightening the screws, so to speak, in Trinidad, a neighborhood IN D.C.

And have you ever been to the Trinidad area of D.C.? Probably not. Do you know why you've never been to that part of town? Because any individual that's not retarded would immediately recognize it as one of the most dangerous places in the country and either avoid it like the plague, or flee if they wandered into it accidentally. It's like Compton. In fact, statistically, it's worse.

These are not checkpoints in neighborhoods where people work hard, exercise good values, and take pride in their community. Trinidad is one of the filthiest, most drug infested communities in the nation. It's not Bethesda, it's not Fairfax, it's the ghetto. You will never go there, you will never be asked to show ID, you will never feel unwelcome, you will never feel like you're being watched. Do you know who will? The crew of homies that piles into cars and drives to the suburbs to break into your neighbor's car on Saturday night. The junkie who barges into the QuickieMart one night while you're inside paying for gas and shoots the place up so he can steal $8 from the register. The degenerate that tries to sell your kid crack while he plays on the playground at school. The gutter punk that breaks into your house while you sleep. The asshole that buys and sells guns ILLEGALLY and makes it impossible for law abiding citizens to change policy and legalize the possession of firearms in Our Nations Capital. If you're worried about hurting those people's feelings, then by all means, bitch away. Me? I kind of wish they'd just put barbed wire around the neighborhood and firebomb it.

D.C. has implemented this type of strategy before, and it worked. Checkpoints are nothing new to Washington, don't think this is the first time they've had to do this. The last one was 10 years ago but no one feels like applying their memory long enough to recall it. Are these checkpoints a long term solution? No, absolutely not. Are they a temporary fix? Absolutely. Would I prefer that law abiding citizens be allowed to have guns in Washington and be able to defend themselves? Without a doubt. But, quite frankly, no one is getting a gun in D.C. until they can get a reasonable hand on the crime problem, and that's the fact of the matter.

New York City was forced to take the same measures in 1992, during which time The Bronx was plagued with violence and drugs. In 1996 a Federal court of appeals defended the legality of such measures by saying they, "served an important public concern" and were "reasonably viewed as an effective mechanism to deter crime in the barricaded area." So it's not like people haven't questioned the legality of issue before.

After hurricane Katrina, New Orleans had checkpoints and a military like police presence in areas where crime had become nearly unmanageable. It had nothing to do with the hurricane itself, it was a direct response to the crime and violence that occurred after it.

In the past, checkpoints have proven to be a reasonable way to control crime in areas of cities that resemble a war zone. Trinidad is one of them.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and make a comparison that I know is going to encourage some moron to tell me I'm comparing two completely different things, but here it is: DUI checkpoints. DUI checkpoints are used to control a problem; drunk driving. Have they proven to be effective? Definitely. Do they stage them in areas where there is a known drunk driving problem? Yes. Are they intimidating and sometimes a little scary? Yes. Do they drag you out of your car, shake you down on the side of the road, make your girlfriend cry, and threaten to set your house on fire? Ummm...no. They stop you, ask you where you're heading, hand you some anti-drunk driving propaganda and send you on your way. Pretty straight forward, huh? Last time I checked, the only people who were angry or terrified over DUI checkpoints were the people who had been busted at one.

Believe me, no one in the area of town in question is complaining about this latest effort to control crime. People are living in fear. Should something have been done sooner? Yes. Unfortunately, drastic measures are required during drastic times, so a checkpoint it is.

Additionally, this story first broke in The Examiner. For those of you that don't know, The Examiner is a liberal rag. It's almost entirely democrat propaganda. I've read that story, I've read the stories comparing D.C. to Soviet Russia, and they all paint a relatively unfair picture of the objectives and intentions of this effort. The media is asking for comments from the ACLU for God's sake. Give me a break.

For those of you that are comparing this to The Third Reich, well, that's just ridiculous.
 

festus

God Bless Our Troops!!!
Third Reich???

It's a little misleading to have addressed this thread as "Police to seal off city," that's a blatant exaggeration. What they're actually doing is tightening the screws, so to speak, in Trinidad, a neighborhood IN D.C.

And have you ever been to the Trinidad area of D.C.? Probably not. Do you know why you've never been to that part of town? Because any individual that's not retarded would immediately recognize it as one of the most dangerous places in the country and either avoid it like the plague, or flee if they wandered into it accidentally. It's like Compton. In fact, statistically, it's worse.

These are not checkpoints in neighborhoods where people work hard, exercise good values, and take pride in their community. Trinidad is one of the filthiest, most drug infested communities in the nation. It's not Bethesda, it's not Fairfax, it's the ghetto. You will never go there, you will never be asked to show ID, you will never feel unwelcome, you will never feel like you're being watched. Do you know who will? The crew of homies that piles into cars and drives to the suburbs to break into your neighbor's car on Saturday night. The junkie who barges into the QuickieMart one night while you're inside paying for gas and shoots the place up so he can steal $8 from the register. The degenerate that tries to sell your kid crack while he plays on the playground at school. The gutter punk that breaks into your house while you sleep. The asshole that buys and sells guns ILLEGALLY and makes it impossible for law abiding citizens to change policy and legalize the possession of firearms in Our Nations Capital. If you're worried about hurting those people's feelings, then by all means, bitch away. Me? I kind of wish they'd just put barbed wire around the neighborhood and firebomb it.

D.C. has implemented this type of strategy before, and it worked. Checkpoints are nothing new to Washington, don't think this is the first time they've had to do this. The last one was 10 years ago but no one feels like applying their memory long enough to recall it. Are these checkpoints a long term solution? No, absolutely not. Are they a temporary fix? Absolutely. Would I prefer that law abiding citizens be allowed to have guns in Washington and be able to defend themselves? Without a doubt. But, quite frankly, no one is getting a gun in D.C. until they can get a reasonable hand on the crime problem, and that's the fact of the matter.

New York City was forced to take the same measures in 1992, during which time The Bronx was plagued with violence and drugs. In 1996 a Federal court of appeals defended the legality of such measures by saying they, "served an important public concern" and were "reasonably viewed as an effective mechanism to deter crime in the barricaded area." So it's not like people haven't questioned the legality of issue before.

After hurricane Katrina, New Orleans had checkpoints and a military like police presence in areas where crime had become nearly unmanageable. It had nothing to do with the hurricane itself, it was a direct response to the crime and violence that occurred after it.

In the past, checkpoints have proven to be a reasonable way to control crime in areas of cities that resemble a war zone. Trinidad is one of them.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and make a comparison that I know is going to encourage some moron to tell me I'm comparing two completely different things, but here it is: DUI checkpoints. DUI checkpoints are used to control a problem; drunk driving. Have they proven to be effective? Definitely. Do they stage them in areas where there is a known drunk driving problem? Yes. Are they intimidating and sometimes a little scary? Yes. Do they drag you out of your car, shake you down on the side of the road, make your girlfriend cry, and threaten to set your house on fire? Ummm...no. They stop you, ask you where you're heading, hand you some anti-drunk driving propaganda and send you on your way. Pretty straight forward, huh? Last time I checked, the only people who were angry or terrified over DUI checkpoints were the people who had been busted at one.

Believe me, no one in the area of town in question is complaining about this latest effort to control crime. People are living in fear. Should something have been done sooner? Yes. Unfortunately, drastic measures are required during drastic times, so a checkpoint it is.

Additionally, this story first broke in The Examiner. For those of you that don't know, The Examiner is a liberal rag. It's almost entirely democrat propaganda. I've read that story, I've read the stories comparing D.C. to Soviet Russia, and they all paint a relatively unfair picture of the objectives and intentions of this effort. The media is asking for comments from the ACLU for God's sake. Give me a break.

For those of you that are comparing this to The Third Reich, well, that's just ridiculous.


I for one think that it is shameful that our nations capital city is a cesspool. If the citizens were allowed to carry...This situation would fix itself much like Detroit did. It ain't perfect but statistically it is much better now that thugs know hey have a chance of becoming a smoking hole during a confrontation.

As far as the German thing...It was a reference to the East Germany of days gone by. You could not move from neighborhood to neighborhood in East Berlin without hitting about 3 checkpoints.

I say we take back the streets one neighborhood at a time until it is safe to let kids play outside again.:angry2:
 

HK4U

New member
I again say when you make it unlawful for law abiding citizens to have the means to defend themselves you end up with only the criminal element with the guns. They then have free reign to do as they please. What is the buracrats answer to the problem? Is it to see the light and let the citizens have the means to defend themselves? Why of course not. Let's make it a police state. We will call this a trial run. See how much loss of freedoms the people will stand for. Next time we will take a little more. Like the frog in water we are slowing being boiled.


"The truth of the matter is that you do have those standby provisions, and the statutory emergency plans are there whereby you could, in the name of stopping terrorism, apprehend, invoke the military, and arrest Americans and hold them in detention camps."
U.S. Representative Henry Gonzalez, August 29, 1994


"Today, America would be outraged if U.N. troops entered Los Angeles to restore order. Tomorrow they will be grateful! This is especially true if they were told that there were an outside threat from beyond, whether real or promulgated, that threatened our very existence. It is then that all peoples of the world will plead to deliver them from this evil. The one thing every man fears is the unknown. When presented with this scenario, individual rights will be willingly relinquished for the guarantee of their well-being granted to them by the World Government."
Dr. Henry Kissinger, Bilderberger Conference, Evians, France, 1991
 
Believe me, no one in the area of town in question is complaining about this latest effort to control crime. People are living in fear. Should something have been done sooner? Yes. Unfortunately, drastic measures are required during drastic times, so a checkpoint it is.
.

Thats pure BS.

You can just search Youtube, many videos of residents against it

Your whole post seem to suggest you support this type of fascist , Hitler, SS type police tactics
and thats a damn shame
How long before they use the same argument to take your city in Tennessee ?
You live comfy in your neck or the woods simply because they haven't expanded this tactics to your area YET

By the way
And have you ever been to the Trinidad area of D.C.? Probably not.

I lived in DC for 7 years, so don't assume
How many years did you spend there ?
 

WaltherCC

New member
I spent 22 there, I moved to Tennessee in August of last year, so thanks for asking. And yes, I completely support this decision. When will they do this in my city? Never, probably. You see, it's not a shit hole, that's kind of why I moved. There aren't 15 to 20 murders a month in my city, probably not in the entire state for that matter. And you think what, this is the first step in a New World Order? You think they're going to be marching down the streets in a few months? I mean Jesus Christ, man. You just can't accept the possibility that the decision to put up check points was out of necessity? Fine. So what's the plan then, today D.C., tomorrow the world? Ok, great. Assume they put up check points in my city. Assume for a moment that they, whoever they is, have "expanded their tactics." You know what? I could care less. You know why? Because I don't live in the hood, and I'm not a crack pusher or a gun smuggler. And, if for some God forsaken reason, my presence IS required in that part of town, and if the police need to ask for my ID at a checkpoint to ensure I'm in the neighborhood for a legitimate reason, have at it. That 30 seconds won't ruin my day. And yes, I'm sure you're right. I'm sure there's some bumbling idiot out there bitching about how horrible everything is is and how they've been violated and whatnot. There ALWAYS is. ALWAYS. But you know what? They're the same people that will be saying, "Gee, it's super nice to be able to walk to the market in the afternoon and not worry about my 9 year old being gunned down."
 

HK4U

New member
I spent 22 there, I moved to Tennessee in August of last year, so thanks for asking. And yes, I completely support this decision. When will they do this in my city? Never, probably. You see, it's not a shit hole, that's kind of why I moved. There aren't 15 to 20 murders a month in my city, probably not in the entire state for that matter. And you think what, this is the first step in a New World Order? You think they're going to be marching down the streets in a few months? I mean Jesus Christ, man. You just can't accept the possibility that the decision to put up check points was out of necessity? Fine. So what's the plan then, today D.C., tomorrow the world? Ok, great. Assume they put up check points in my city. Assume for a moment that they, whoever they is, have "expanded their tactics." You know what? I could care less. You know why? Because I don't live in the hood, and I'm not a crack pusher or a gun smuggler. And, if for some God forsaken reason, my presence IS required in that part of town, and if the police need to ask for my ID at a checkpoint to ensure I'm in the neighborhood for a legitimate reason, have at it. That 30 seconds won't ruin my day. And yes, I'm sure you're right. I'm sure there's some bumbling idiot out there bitching about how horrible everything is is and how they've been violated and whatnot. There ALWAYS is. ALWAYS. But you know what? They're the same people that will be saying, "Gee, it's super nice to be able to walk to the market in the afternoon and not worry about my 9 year old being gunned down."


i think most of us here have not bought in to the idea that BIG Brother is the ansewer to all our problems but rather understand that it is the cause of most of them. Letme ask you this. If you are willing to give up a few rights for a little security where are you willing to draw the line? Or are you willing to abanden all your rights?

When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.


When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.


When they came for the Jews,
I remained silent;
I wasn't a Jew.


When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.


Stand for something or fall for everything.
 

RDW

New member
Just to light a fire what is the difference between this and a "Gated Community" which no one seems to have a problem with.

Gated: Security paid for by the home owners in that community

This: Paid for by every tax payer in DC, and in part by everyone who pays federal tax as the police receive a federal or state subsidy.
 

Ruger Lady

New member
These are not checkpoints in neighborhoods where people work hard, exercise good values, and take pride in their community. Trinidad is one of the filthiest, most drug infested communities in the nation. It's not Bethesda, it's not Fairfax, it's the ghetto. You will never go there, you will never be asked to show ID, you will never feel unwelcome, you will never feel like you're being watched. Do you know who will? The crew of homies that piles into cars and drives to the suburbs to break into your neighbor's car on Saturday night. The junkie who barges into the QuickieMart one night while you're inside paying for gas and shoots the place up so he can steal $8 from the register. The degenerate that tries to sell your kid crack while he plays on the playground at school. The gutter punk that breaks into your house while you sleep. The asshole that buys and sells guns ILLEGALLY and makes it impossible for law abiding citizens to change policy and legalize the possession of firearms in Our Nations Capital.

I guess I'm misunderstanding how these "Neighborhood Safety Zones' work? :hmhm:I thought they are to be set up to check the ID's of the people ENTERING the neighborhood, not exiting? How are these checkpoints going to make the non-ghetto area's of D.C. safer? If you really think about it and I do not endorse it, they should set up checkpoints around non-ghetto areas to make sure that no criminal types get into these neighborhoods.
 

WaltherCC

New member
i think most of us here have not bought in to the idea that BIG Brother is the ansewer to all our problems but rather understand that it is the cause of most of them. Letme ask you this. If you are willing to give up a few rights for a little security where are you willing to draw the line? Or are you willing to abanden all your rights?

When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.


When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.


When they came for the Jews,
I remained silent;
I wasn't a Jew.


When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.


Stand for something or fall for everything.

Dude, what is that supposed to mean. No one is coming for anyone. They're attempting to deter criminal activity, and hopefully, restore some order to a neighborhood that is slowly killing itself. Those comparisons to genocide, to political imprisonment, and religious persecution, are way out of line. That's just silly. So, are you concerned you may be next? Well then don't sell drugs or murder people. Don't turn your neighborhood in to a slum.

And they're not demanding that people give up any rights by submitting to a stop at a security checkpoint. That's why the fed's ruled this method of crime prevention acceptable in the 90's, it's not asking anyone to forfeit any inherent rights. They're not kicking in doors, they're asking for ID, and intention. That's not against the law, nor is it unreasonable.

Every time you fly you go through a metal detector and have your bag x-rayed, right? Why? To protect innocent people from getting hurt. It's that simple. The FAA determined that a security check point in an airport is the single most effective way to ensure innocent people aren't hurt or killed by people with bad intentions.

A security checkpoint in Trinidad is, at the moment, the single most effective way to ensure order can be restored and innocent people can be safe and protected from bad people.
 

boris

New member
the solution is

to let them kill each other off. walthercc, how old are you? every tyranny begins somewhere. those who give up libety and freedom for security deserve none. first it starts with the ID bit. then "Herr Boris, I need to see your travel documents". then they start kicking the doors in because they are bored and need to justify their budget. if the people want freedom, security and liberty, they need to speak out and start putting holes in scumbags. when this starts happening{yes, good people will die, just like in all wars} tey will get their hood back. I would rather die a free man than live with a boot in my throat. extreme ? yeah, maybe so. The Founders had the same attitude.
 

HK4U

New member
Dude, what is that supposed to mean. No one is coming for anyone. They're attempting to deter criminal activity, and hopefully, restore some order to a neighborhood that is slowly killing itself. Those comparisons to genocide, to political imprisonment, and religious persecution, are way out of line. That's just silly. So, are you concerned you may be next? Well then don't sell drugs or murder people. Don't turn your neighborhood in to a slum.

And they're not demanding that people give up any rights by submitting to a stop at a security checkpoint. That's why the fed's ruled this method of crime prevention acceptable in the 90's, it's not asking anyone to forfeit any inherent rights. They're not kicking in doors, they're asking for ID, and intention. That's not against the law, nor is it unreasonable.

Every time you fly you go through a metal detector and have your bag x-rayed, right? Why? To protect innocent people from getting hurt. It's that simple. The FAA determined that a security check point in an airport is the single most effective way to ensure innocent people aren't hurt or killed by people with bad intentions.

A security checkpoint in Trinidad is, at the moment, the single most effective way to ensure order can be restored and innocent people can be safe and protected from bad people.



So, are you concerned you may be next? Well then don't sell drugs or murder people. Don't turn your neighborhood in to a slum.


Yes. think the government only comes after real criminals? Then you either have not been paying attention or you are living on a different planet than the rest of us.

What about next month or next week or next year when the check point is in your town or mine to check for guns. You know the ones us criminals don't turn in by order of the government. Oh that is right you trust big brother I forgot.
 

festus

God Bless Our Troops!!!
for the record

The Nazi's set up checkpoints in Warsaw because of a "crime threat"...then began harassing the Jews.

The Communists set up checkpoints in Berlin to keep dissidents from escaping to the West.

The Somali Warlords set up road blocks to control the flow of food and potential soldiers (boys as young as 12 pulled away from parents and made to fight men's battles with men's guns.)

Sudanese Warlords in Darfur set up roadblocks and checkpoints to hunt down Christians...killing the adults and selling the children as sex slaves (Legal under their laws as Christians rank lower than dogs).

Chinese communists set up checkpoints and road blocks to keep the population from moving to better areas and keep the workforce in place (while hunting for Christians).

The US Border patrol sets up roadblocks to check for citizenship and will give you a hard time even when they know you are American if you don't play nice. (If you don't believe me, drive through NM and hit a USBP checkpoint. Ask them under what constitutional authority they have to detain a US citizen and be prepared to wait it out, get a free body cavity search, and have your car taken apart while they look for "suspected" drugs...which by the way they do not have to reassemble it).

The Whole idea is a crock. It is not a good Idea to let the Government control your comings and goings for any reason.

It is Illegal Search and Seizure without probable cause. It is a violation of both the fourth and fifth amendments. Yes I know the fifth is the right to remain silent, but if you don't answer their questions they will run you in.(more body cavity searches and vehicle disassembly because you stood on your rights and ticked them off).

It is a power trip plain and simple. The purpose of this exercise is prove an unarmed populace can be controlled.

Now Herr Walther...PAPERS PLEASE!
 

HK4U

New member
couldn't said it better myself

The Nazi's set up checkpoints in Warsaw because of a "crime threat"...then began harassing the Jews.

The Communists set up checkpoints in Berlin to keep dissidents from escaping to the West.

The Somali Warlords set up road blocks to control the flow of food and potential soldiers (boys as young as 12 pulled away from parents and made to fight men's battles with men's guns.)

Sudanese Warlords in Darfur set up roadblocks and checkpoints to hunt down Christians...killing the adults and selling the children as sex slaves (Legal under their laws as Christians rank lower than dogs).

Chinese communists set up checkpoints and road blocks to keep the population from moving to better areas and keep the workforce in place (while hunting for Christians).

The US Border patrol sets up roadblocks to check for citizenship and will give you a hard time even when they know you are American if you don't play nice. (If you don't believe me, drive through NM and hit a USBP checkpoint. Ask them under what constitutional authority they have to detain a US citizen and be prepared to wait it out, get a free body cavity search, and have your car taken apart while they look for "suspected" drugs...which by the way they do not have to reassemble it).

The Whole idea is a crock. It is not a good Idea to let the Government control your comings and goings for any reason.

It is Illegal Search and Seizure without probable cause. It is a violation of both the fourth and fifth amendments. Yes I know the fifth is the right to remain silent, but if you don't answer their questions they will run you in.(more body cavity searches and vehicle disassembly because you stood on your rights and ticked them off).

It is a power trip plain and simple. The purpose of this exercise is prove an unarmed populace can be controlled.

Now Herr Walther...PAPERS PLEASE!


Some very excellent points festus. Thanks for posting.
 

hwhite1725

New member
Dude, what is that supposed to mean. No one is coming for anyone. They're attempting to deter criminal activity, and hopefully, restore some order to a neighborhood that is slowly killing itself. Those comparisons to genocide, to political imprisonment, and religious persecution, are way out of line. That's just silly. So, are you concerned you may be next? Well then don't sell drugs or murder people. Don't turn your neighborhood in to a slum.

And they're not demanding that people give up any rights by submitting to a stop at a security checkpoint. That's why the fed's ruled this method of crime prevention acceptable in the 90's, it's not asking anyone to forfeit any inherent rights. They're not kicking in doors, they're asking for ID, and intention. That's not against the law, nor is it unreasonable.

Every time you fly you go through a metal detector and have your bag x-rayed, right? Why? To protect innocent people from getting hurt. It's that simple. The FAA determined that a security check point in an airport is the single most effective way to ensure innocent people aren't hurt or killed by people with bad intentions.

A security checkpoint in Trinidad is, at the moment, the single most effective way to ensure order can be restored and innocent people can be safe and protected from bad people.


Another point, they are not "just checking ID's", they are turning away people who don't have "business" there or live in the neighborhood. Who decides what "business" is acceptable? Maybe I want to walk through there to get somewhere else without walking around, or maybe I just want to walk there. This is America, we have fought and died for freedom. Even though it is miniscule to some, the freedom to do something like walk through a bad neighborhood belongs to all of us.
 

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