Customer Service Issues with K and D Holsters

[weekendskp]

After searching for what I thought might be the perfect holster for my wife to carry her Kel-Tec PF-9 with a CT laser, I decided on K and D Holsters. I called the number, gave them my order, and the guy says it will be 8-10 weeks. Okay, that's a long time to wait I thought, but my wife doesn't even have her permit yet so i completed the sale. This morning, I sent Kevin an email asking when to expect the holster, and he repeated the estimate of 8 to 10 weeks, but canceled my order so I wouldn't, in his words, have to wait any longer. Now, does that make sense? Opinions and comments always appreciated.

 

[FloridaBlue]

I'm confused, he cancelled your order because you asked him how long it would take? Second are these custom made holsters as 8-10 weeks seems a little excessive.

 

[weekendskp]

I ordered and paid for the holster on January 31, 2011. Yesterday was exactly eight weeks, so I emailed him inquiring when to expect the holster, and he said not to expect it until April 11 which would be 10 weeks. K&D sells a variety, but will customize the options. I thought 8 weeks was a bit excessive too, and as a customer, I know when someone hears 8 - 10 weeks, they're not hearing "10 weeks"; they're hearing "8 weeks". Furthermore, I've ordered custom holsters that were promised in 6 weeks, but always arrived early.

 

[weekendskp]

Kevin from K&D Holsters did as he promised. The purchase price was refunded to my credit card. Ten weeks is too long to wait for a holster; I don't care how good he thinks his product is if the customer never gets it, it's not worth it.

 

[SGB]

If you order a custom product you have to understand that timelines are estimates and expect to wait. K&D makes an EXCELLENT product and canceling an order over a mere two additional weeks is in my opinion "cutting off your nose to spite your face."

 

[K-Man]

It always seems that people only give half the story.

We clearly state on our website, and in conversation with the customer, that the turnaround time for our holsters is 8-10 weeks. This was reiterated to weekendskp.

Right on the 8-week mark, I received the following email inquiry from him:
"By my calculations, it's been eight weeks to the day since I placed my order. I've been patient, even though I felt eight weeks was excessive to make a holster. When can I expect my order?"

When a customer comes in and tells me that our business practices (even though they know up front what they are) are excessive, I don't have to tolerate that. I'm not going to listen to someone criticize us.

In a subsequent email he wrote:
"I will spread the word of your business practices to the many forums of which I belong."

Some people would view that to mean weekendskp is going to spread negative comments about us. There's nothing negative about what our stated practices are.

Our turnaround times have nothing to do with "how good we think our product is." Our turnaround times are based on the volume of work we have to do. I run a business, I have more than one customer. We make/offer a variety of product. It takes the amount of time it does to get through the orders. That's just the way it is. If weekendskp doesn't like it, then move on to someone else.

 

[weekendskp]

We clearly state on our website, and in conversation with the customer, that the turnaround time for our holsters is 8-10 weeks. This was reiterated to weekendskp.

Right on the 8-week mark, I received the following email inquiry from him:

By my calculations, it's been eight weeks to the day since I placed my order. I've been patient, even though I felt eight weeks was excessive to make a holster. When can I expect my order?

I informed you that the turnaround time for the holster is 8-10 weeks. The calculations would show that would make your order due out of here by April 11, 2011.

However, since you feel the 8-week wait was excessive, I don't want to make you wait any longer. I am canceling your order and refunding the amount of $55.50 to your credit card account. That credit should be reflected on your account in 2-3 days. That action will resolve your having to wait any further.

First off, I didn't cancel the order; Kevin made that decision unilaterally. My issue is not the waiting another two weeks to receive what I paid for. My issue is in K&D customer service. If they know or have reason to believe that it will take 10 weeks, then they should state "10 weeks". The customer does not perceive an estimate of 8-10 weeks to be 10 weeks. The customer perceives that at 8 weeks, he might be expecting his order, which is what I did. Secondly, Kevin did NOT say, "I quoted 10 weeks, if you don't want to wait, I'll refund your money." The average concealed carry licensee owns a drawer full of holsters. It's a good time to be in the business of making holsters. The demand is high, but I'll NEVER buy another holster from K&D, and regardless of how good business is, one can't afford to alienate a customer, especially one merely eager to get his hands on the desired product.

Lastly, Kevin sent me an email that said I wasn't forthright about the content of my message. It is in quotes at the top for all to see. Customers have expectations when purchasing. Businesses can manage expectations so as not to disappoint the customer. K&D failed in that regard.

 

[K-Man]

weekendskp:

You seem not to understand, even though I stated the reason, why your order was canceled. You essentially came into our shop and criticized our business practice(s). Let me say again, I don't tolerate that - never have and never will.

We did not fail in any sense. You're unhappy because I cut you off after you criticized us. And now you expect me to just roll over? I don't roll over just to make a sale.

And I'll state here as well - the customer is not always right. You seem to be under the impression that that is a golden rule in business. Actually it's a misconception.

You made your bed, now you can lay in it.

Good luck in your search for a holster.

 

[weekendskp]

Mr. Manley was kind enough to point out that the customer is not always right. I was critical of the excessive time it took their understaffed operation to assemble a holster so he refused to sell the item to me. So, I did some research and found out that the customer IS NOT always right. But the customer IS business, and without the customer, you get a condition similar to "one hand clapping" - silence. If the business owner is so thin skinned as to take it personal when someone thinks that 2 1/2 months to make a holster is excessive, he won't be in business for long. Well, for two reasons, that it takes that long to make a holster, and that expecting it any sooner results in no sale.

 

[K-Man]

...If the business owner is so thin skinned as to take it personal when someone thinks that 2 1/2 months to make a holster is excessive, he won't be in business for long. Well, for two reasons, that it takes that long to make a holster, and that expecting it any sooner results in no sale.

Hmmm....I've been in business for over 10 years now, and have had the same practices/policies in place. So yet again your comments hold no credence. And for your information, it wasn't all that long ago (less than 2 years) that our turnaround time was double what it is now, and guess what? We were grossing over $100k annually in sales.

I'd suggest you rethink your perspective, Mr. weekendskp, because throughout this issue you've been on faulty ground. It becomes apparent with every posting you make that you don't know what you're talking about. But if you want to keep on, please feel free to do so.

 

[weekendskp]

I'd suggest you rethink your perspective, Mr. weekendskp, because throughout this issue you've been on faulty ground. It becomes apparent with every posting you make that you don't know what you're talking about. But if you want to keep on, please feel free to do so.

You obviously don't make the holsters yourself any more. If you did, you wouldn't have time with your backlog of work to sit at a computer all day and haggle with an alienated customer about who is or isn't right in this deal gone awry. I'm guessing you stopped making the holsters about two years ago because that's when your production time was miraculously cut in half.

You will notice that only you and I have penned the last five posts. Do you know why? BECAUSE NOBODY WANTS TO GET IN THE MIDDLE OF A SHOUTING ARGUMENT. I read the forums. I steer clear of vendors where there's even a hint of impropriety. Oooh, there's a eight-hundred pound gorilla in the corner of the room. Take the red pill. No, take the blue pill.

 

[SGB]

weekendskp in my opinion you instigated the pissing contest, you'll find in life that you get more by being polite than by being belligerent. The only looser in all this is you.

 

[weekendskp]

weekendskp in my opinion you instigated the pissing contest, you'll find in life that you get more by being polite than by being belligerent. The only looser in all this is you.

Nobody said this was a pissing contest, and I haven't lost anything. Oh, and the definition of looser is "not tight". A loser is someone like yourself who can't spell. Urban Dictionary: looser

 

[SGB]

Nobody said this was a pissing contest, and I haven't lost anything. Oh, and the definition of looser is "not tight". A loser is someone like yourself who can't spell. Urban Dictionary: looser

I apologize to you and all the other internet spelling Nazi's for the typo. :wacko: - Your post above only reinforces my original opinion, you don't play well with others. :to_pick_ones_nose:

 

[K-Man]

Our website is K&D Holsters | Custom Gun Leather and Shooting Accessories. We offer pocket holsters, mag holders, and gun belts for a variety of guns.

 

[walther380]

Do you make a holster for a Walther PK380. I like to wear at 4:30-5:00. But Im skinny so I need something that stays close to the body.

 

[K-Man]

walther380: I'm sorry to say we do not offer holsters for the Walther PK380. We no longer have access to one, which we would need in order to fashion the holster. You might consider the folks at Milt Sparks holsters.

 

[TheFollower]

Expectations lead to sour grapes.

If the delivery time says 8-10 weeks then one best not complain until after week 10 comes and goes. Nothing wrong with an inquiry at 8 weeks tho. The statement about a customer's expectation of 8 weeks is true many times but that does not make it a right expectation. And ones personal expectations places no onus on the company to change their agreed upon service level agreements. Expectations always sets one up for disappointment.

Has anyone heard "under-commit but over-deliver"? I am a project manager and it is what I do for a living. Should the company say 8-10 weeks and deliver in exactly 8 weeks one would be satisfied customer. If the company delivered in 6 weeks the customer would be on this forum singing the praises of the company.

If 8-10 weeks is too long, accordingly to an individuals shopping perception, then simply shop elsewhere. It is the customer's choice to wait that long for the product. And there are other places to buy holsters.

I encourage Kevin to go back to making great holsters. Sometimes we cannot make every customer happy. If anything, your company recvd some attention on this forum and IMHO it is not bad press. Now that I know you are there, I look to doing some business once I pick up my pocket carry weapon.

 

[S&WM&P40]

I apologize to you and all the other internet spelling Nazi's for the typo. :wacko: - Your post above only reinforces my original opinion, you don't play well with others. :to_pick_ones_nose:

Don't worry about it. It's the internet! I'm still shocked that people type in complete sentences and don't abbreviate everything. It's not a college term paper,work paper etc.. I could give two S***s if I spell things wrong on the internet. Don't let the trolls get you.

 

[S&WM&P40]

walther380: I'm sorry to say we do not offer holsters for the Walther PK380. We no longer have access to one, which we would need in order to fashion the holster. You might consider the folks at Milt Sparks holsters.

What if the customer sent in their firearm?