Citizen cites WA cop for patrolling in unmarked cruiser...

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Evidently it is against the law for WA officers to patrol in unmarked cruisers, because a citizen never knows if they are actually being pulled over by an officer or an imposter. Unmarked vehicles can only be used for undercover work. The citizen went over the applicable law, took the officer's info and sent him on his way with a warning and a suggestion that he speak with his superiors about the violation of the law. The officer listened and cooperated with the citizen.

 
From the statute:
RCW 46.08.065: Publicly owned vehicles to be marked ? Exceptions.

(3) Subsection (2) of this section shall not apply to vehicles used by the Washington state patrol for general undercover or confidential investigative purposes. Traffic control vehicles of the Washington state patrol may be exempted from the requirements of subsection (2) of this section at the discretion of the chief of the Washington state patrol. The *department of general administration shall adopt general rules permitting other exceptions to the requirements of subsection (2) of this section for other vehicles used for law enforcement, confidential public health work, and public assistance fraud or support investigative purposes, for vehicles leased or rented by the state on a casual basis for a period of less than ninety days, and those provided for in **RCW 46.08.066(3). The exceptions in this subsection, subsection (4) of this section, and those provided for in **RCW 46.08.066(3) shall be the only exceptions permitted to the requirements of subsection (2) of this section.

The * note:

Reviser's note: *(1) The "department of general administration" was renamed the "department of enterprise services" by 2011 1st sp.s. c 43 § 107.

Now, the WAC contains the general rules that the department of enterprise services has adopted:
WAC 200-500-040: Exceptions to marking requirements.

WAC 200-500-040
Exceptions to marking requirements.
(1) Requests for exceptions shall be forwarded to the director of general administration by the head of the agency owning or controlling the vehicle. Requests for exceptions normally will not be granted unless the vehicle is used more than 50% of the time for law enforcement, confidential public health work, public assistance fraud or support investigative purposes.
(2) Vehicles leased or rented on a casual basis for a period less than ninety days and not issued a state exempt license plate need not be marked.
(3) Vehicles issued confidential license plates under the provisions of section 2, chapter 169, Laws of 1975 1st ex. sess. and chapter 46.08 RCW, are exempt from marking requirements.

So, Chief of WSP requests an exception to the marking requirements for cars used more than 50% of the time for law enforcement, the director of general administration approves the exception as a matter of routine, and the unmarked cars are legal to operate.

Now the question becomes, does the vehicle in question have an exception that was submitted by the chief of the WSP and approved by the director of general administration? Not that anybody really cares....
 
What a bunch of narcissistic silliness. He got to show up a cop on the internet. There are proper and more effective ways to deal with infractions. If he believes a law is being broken, which appears to be the case here for Washington state, he should file a complaint with the sheriff, state police, or state and/or local prosecutor (attorney general). He could report it to the media. If any private citizen can confront an offender of this type, then anyone who sees you make a traffic violation can follow you and demand to see your license. That defeats the intent of being sure that you know if a real LEO is pulling you over.

An anti-gun nut may see that you are printing and “suspect” that you are not licensed to carry, or you may have entered a legislated non-carry area. In line with the authority claimed in this video they would be able to demand to see your carry license and ID.
 
What a bunch of narcissistic silliness. He got to show up a cop on the internet. There are proper and more effective ways to deal with infractions. If he believes a law is being broken, which appears to be the case here for Washington state, he should file a complaint with the sheriff, state police, or state and/or local prosecutor (attorney general). He could report it to the media. If any private citizen can confront an offender of this type, then anyone who sees you make a traffic violation can follow you and demand to see your license. That defeats the intent of being sure that you know if a real LEO is pulling you over.

An anti-gun nut may see that you are printing and “suspect” that you are not licensed to carry, or you may have entered a legislated non-carry area. In line with the authority claimed in this video they would be able to demand to see your carry license and ID.

Total deflection. The videographer was confronting a cop, a public official and a representative of the government, not a private citizen.

Way to stand up for the premise that only cops or other agents of government can hold people accountable for lawlessness. Citizens ain't nuthin' in our system of government, right? Oh, wait, I seem to recall a phrase....a kind of introduction.....actually, the Preamble to the Constitution that says:

We, the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect Union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

That cop, and all cops and other agents of government, are subservient to the authorities we granted them. We are their creators - they are our creatures. As I quoted Alexander Hamilton saying in Federalist 78 earlier in the thread, "To deny this, would be to affirm, that the deputy is greater than his principal; that the servant is above his master; that the representatives of the people are superior to the people themselves; that men acting by virtue of powers, may do not only what their powers do not authorize, but what they forbid."

Gavin Seim is a Patriot to the Constitution and the laws written under its auspices. I don't know him personally, so to argue for or against the premise that he's a "narcissist" would make me a fool to assert any knowledge of. Anybody who would argue such would prove themselves a fool.

Blues
 
“Total deflection … not a private citizen”. In my 4th sentence I pointed out that there probably was a violation of Washington state law. I then pointed out a more effect effective means of dealing with the problem. One does not does not give up one’s rights as a LEO. They are granted certain responsibilities and limited authority by the state. They are not part of a subservient class.

It is interesting that he insists on seeing the officer’s license and ID. Although in another video in Boise, he insists that the police have no right to ask for his. In another video he runs a fruit inspection station. Both times he cites the “unreasonable searches and seizures” clause of the 4th Amendment. According to the Sheriff's office he has had interaction with that deputy several times in the past.

There is more to the Constitution the preamble. The ensuing articles and amendments delineate how justice is established, domestic tranquility ensured, etc. Offices and governmental agencies are created to establish laws and regulations. State constitutions follow a similar pattern. The rights of the individual is balanced against the rights of the people as a whole. It is not always a perfect balance.

Mr. Seim did go the Sheriff’s office later. They are correcting the matter. It was a temporary situation. The Sheriff’s statement is on Mr. Seim’s Facebook page. The situation could have been settled by going to the Sheriff in the first place. But then Mr. Seim could not have presented himself as this heroic crusader. He has several posts on the internet in which he identifies himself as Liberty Speaker. He makes sure that he has face time on the videos while expounding his viewpoints. There is not enough information to say that he meets the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders criteria for Narcissistic Personality Disorder, but there is evidence that he meets the colloquial definition. That, by the way, does not automatically make what he may say to be right or wrong.
 
Evidently it is against the law for WA officers to patrol in unmarked cruisers, because a citizen never knows if they are actually being pulled over by an officer or an imposter. Unmarked vehicles can only be used for undercover work. The citizen went over the applicable law, took the officer's info and sent him on his way with a warning and a suggestion that he speak with his superiors about the violation of the law. The officer listened and cooperated with the citizen.



I give that P.O. a lot of credit for being patient and answering this self-impressed nitwit's questions. My first words would have been “What’s the emergency?” When nitwit started his diatribe I just would have driven away. If I had decided to be polite to a bore with waaay to much time on his hands, I would never have shown him my ID card, nor discussed any enforcement activity I had taken. Want to know what I did today? File an FOIA with my agency. Oh and my window would have been rolled down about 1" & I would have mumbled my responses to monkey-wrench his little dog-and-pony video show, just like the other "activists" I've had to deal with.

As to driving an unmarked police car in violation of the relevant statue, I would have explained that in an effort to fully serve the citizens of my G.A.O.E. my supervisor had me use a vehicle that hadn't been marked yet so that no sector would go uncovered. But since he was making an issue of it-including threatening to call a county sheriff to summons me for the violation-I would be more than happy to go back to my HQ and earn my days $$ the easy way by sitting and answering phone, dispatching, working the desk, ect., instead of risking my a$$ doing REAL POLICE WORK, like traffic enforcement and crime suppression.

And as the calls for service came in from citizens being victimized by criminals, needing acute medical care [diff breathers, cardiacs, heavy bleeders] help locating their missing family members with Alzheimers, ect., I would have reluctantly told them that because of Mr. Seim's vigilance in holding his local PD to the letter of the law, they would have to wait for until a LEGALLY MARKED police car could get there to assist them.
 
I give that P.O. a lot of credit for being patient and answering this self-impressed nitwit's questions. My first words would have been “What’s the emergency?” When nitwit started his diatribe I just would have driven away. If I had decided to be polite to a bore with waaay to much time on his hands, I would never have shown him my ID card, nor discussed any enforcement activity I had taken. Want to know what I did today? File an FOIA with my agency. Oh and my window would have been rolled down about 1" & I would have mumbled my responses to monkey-wrench his little dog-and-pony video show, just like the other "activists" I've had to deal with.

As to driving an unmarked police car in violation of the relevant statue, I would have explained that in an effort to fully serve the citizens of my G.A.O.E. my supervisor had me use a vehicle that hadn't been marked yet so that no sector would go uncovered. But since he was making an issue of it-including threatening to call a county sheriff to summons me for the violation-I would be more than happy to go back to my HQ and earn my days $$ the easy way by sitting and answering phone, dispatching, working the desk, ect., instead of risking my a$$ doing REAL POLICE WORK, like traffic enforcement and crime suppression.

And as the calls for service came in from citizens being victimized by criminals, needing acute medical care [diff breathers, cardiacs, heavy bleeders] help locating their missing family members with Alzheimers, ect., I would have reluctantly told them that because of Mr. Seim's vigilance in holding his local PD to the letter of the law, they would have to wait for until a LEGALLY MARKED police car could get there to assist them.

No wonder people dislike cops.

Sent from my HTCONE using USA Carry mobile app
 
No wonder people dislike cops.

Really. So they either get even with the narcissistic, silly, self-impressed nitwits on-scene, or if they get beat in a battle of knowledge of the law with a citizen, they get even with the citizen's wider community instead of just following the law.

Classic summary judgment and punishment for the crime of contempt of cop. Screw the law! I AM THE LAW! is the attitude portrayed in that screed.

Blues
 
I give that P.O. a lot of credit for being patient and answering this self-impressed nitwit's questions. My first words would have been “What’s the emergency?” When nitwit started his diatribe I just would have driven away. If I had decided to be polite to a bore with waaay to much time on his hands, I would never have shown him my ID card, nor discussed any enforcement activity I had taken. Want to know what I did today? File an FOIA with my agency. Oh and my window would have been rolled down about 1" & I would have mumbled my responses to monkey-wrench his little dog-and-pony video show, just like the other "activists" I've had to deal with.

As to driving an unmarked police car in violation of the relevant statue, I would have explained that in an effort to fully serve the citizens of my G.A.O.E. my supervisor had me use a vehicle that hadn't been marked yet so that no sector would go uncovered. But since he was making an issue of it-including threatening to call a county sheriff to summons me for the violation-I would be more than happy to go back to my HQ and earn my days $$ the easy way by sitting and answering phone, dispatching, working the desk, ect., instead of risking my a$$ doing REAL POLICE WORK, like traffic enforcement and crime suppression.

And as the calls for service came in from citizens being victimized by criminals, needing acute medical care [diff breathers, cardiacs, heavy bleeders] help locating their missing family members with Alzheimers, ect., I would have reluctantly told them that because of Mr. Seim's vigilance in holding his local PD to the letter of the law, they would have to wait for until a LEGALLY MARKED police car could get there to assist them.

Well Sarge... YOU swore to uphold the law and the Constitution of the U.S. to the best of your ability; not hide behind FOIA requests, lie about supervisory orders, sit on your duff over technicalities, and retard public safety calls as retribution.
I do hope, that you sir, are not part of my local constabulary.
 
Really. So they either get even with the narcissistic, silly, self-impressed nitwits on-scene, or if they get beat in a battle of knowledge of the law with a citizen, they get even with the citizen's wider community instead of just following the law. Classic summary judgment and punishment for the crime of contempt of cop. Screw the law! I AM THE LAW! is the attitude portrayed in that screed.

NOT AT ALL.

1.) I’m not getting even. I just reduced Seim’s argument to the absurd, i.e. that no unmarked police vehicles should be allowed to perform enforcement functions, and illustrated the untenable results that would occur. So save your anger for Mr. Seim, who inhabits a world devoid of common sense? In the real world, a minor technical violation is ignored for a short time [no department decals on the sector car] so that the greater good [keeping the maximum amount of police on patrol] prevails. This logic obviously escapes Mr. Seim.

I’m a little confused by this statement: “Screw the law! I AM THE LAW!” Hmm. According to you, if I continue to patrol in violation of the law, I’M SCREWING THE LAW, or disregarding the law, taking the law into my own hands, not upholding my oath or whatever. But if I take my car out of service to be in compliance of said law, I’m now making a “Classic summary judgment and punishment of the citizen’s wider community for the crime of contempt of cop.” Whatever that is.

Heads you win, Tails I lose. Nice try, but please make up your mind on what you want me to do.

And Im not judging or punishing anyone. Its Mr. Seim who thinks the operation of an unmarked patrol car is a greater threat to the community than the lack of a police resource.

2.) “Getting beat in a battle of knowledge of the law with a citizen” Oh Wow, he researched some obscure section of the Washington State Admin code and played “gotcha” with a cop. This is an issue for the leadership. a front line police officer is hardly expected to know the administrative rules governing the decaling of law enforcement vehicles. And Mr. Seim knows it too. Instead of badgering the cop, he should have gone to the executive leadership and made his concerns known. But that doesn’t have the emotional wallop of chagrining a cop for his ego.



Well Sarge... YOU swore to uphold the law and the Constitution of the U.S. to the best of your ability; not hide behind FOIA requests, lie about supervisory orders, sit on your duff over technicalities, and retard public safety calls as retribution. I do hope, that you sir, are not part of my local constabulary.

YOU BETTER HOPE MR. SEIM DOESN’T GET TO WRITE THE RULES FOR YOUR CONSTABULARY.

3.) “Well Sarge... YOU swore to uphold the law and the Constitution of the U.S. to the best of your ability;” I do. By department R’s & P’s and my union agreement, It is also my duty to uphold my department’s image and I have a right to protect my reputation from ridicule, or be forced to endure the harassment of nonsense acts. That means I don’t have be a sock puppet in some buffoon’s video. I don’t have to answer questions not directly related to my job at my level. I only have to ID myself by name, shield number and command [Pct.] when in uniform. There’s a name plate with my last name on it under my shield which has a unique number. I don’t have to spell it for you, give you a pen to write it down, or provide any other form of ID.

4.) “not hide behind FOIA requests” My dept. has a public information officer. He is the official voice of the department. The R’s & P’s state that no one is to make any statements about the department, its policies & procedures, any investigation, release any work product, or make any comments or statements unless it had been cleared by the PIO. This is to preclude the release of false, misleading, confusing or incorrect information.

There are also privacy act laws and dept. policies which precluded the release of complainant/victim/witness information for obvious reasons. Any arrest information is of course public information, but that doesn’t mean I can release it to anyone who asks. How would you feel if I responded to Mr. Seim with information about a sexual assault that happened to a family member of yours? The dept. has established a mechanism for releasing this info and I have to follow it. So Im not hiding behind anything.

5.) “lie about supervisory orders” Do you mean the car marking regulations? I’m not expected to know them. And if assigned an unmarked car by my patrol Sgt.,in violation of said code, he assumes the onus of the violation, not me. And for the “I was just following orders” is not an excuse crowd, this is at best a violation of an administrative code section, not a Nuremburg class felony.

6.) “sit on your duff over technicalities, and retard public safety calls as retribution.” My dept.’s R’s & P’s and my contract say if my sector car is pulled out of service for mechanical or other reasons I am to be reassigned according to the needs of the dept. That’s not sitting on my duff over a technicality, or retarding calls for service in retribution. That would be the absurd result if the Seim’s of this world were actually empowered to act on their lunatic ideas. Or do you actually think I’d get sent home with ½ a days pay?

7.)"No wonder people dislike cops." Yeh my dad always said if you wanted to be liked become a firefighter or medic. However, I don't run my life like a popularity contest. IDGAD who likes or dislikes me. I only care about going home at the end of my tour.
 
Really. So they either get even with the narcissistic, silly, self-impressed nitwits on-scene, or if they get beat in a battle of knowledge of the law with a citizen, they get even with the citizen's wider community instead of just following the law. Classic summary judgment and punishment for the crime of contempt of cop. Screw the law! I AM THE LAW! is the attitude portrayed in that screed.

NOT AT ALL.

1.) I’m not getting even. I just reduced Seim’s argument to the absurd, i.e. that no unmarked police vehicles should be allowed to perform enforcement functions, and illustrated the untenable results that would occur. So save your anger for Mr. Seim, who inhabits a world devoid of common sense? In the real world, a minor technical violation is ignored for a short time [no department decals on the sector car] so that the greater good [keeping the maximum amount of police on patrol] prevails. This logic obviously escapes Mr. Seim.

I’m a little confused by this statement: “Screw the law! I AM THE LAW!” Hmm. According to you, if I continue to patrol in violation of the law, I’M SCREWING THE LAW, or disregarding the law, taking the law into my own hands, not upholding my oath or whatever. But if I take my car out of service to be in compliance of said law, I’m now making a “Classic summary judgment and punishment of the citizen’s wider community for the crime of contempt of cop.” Whatever that is.

Heads you win, Tails I lose. Nice try, but please make up your mind on what you want me to do.

And Im not judging or punishing anyone. Its Mr. Seim who thinks the operation of an unmarked patrol car is a greater threat to the community than the lack of a police resource.

2.) “Getting beat in a battle of knowledge of the law with a citizen” Oh Wow, he researched some obscure section of the Washington State Admin code and played “gotcha” with a cop. This is an issue for the leadership. a front line police officer is hardly expected to know the administrative rules governing the decaling of law enforcement vehicles. And Mr. Seim knows it too. Instead of badgering the cop, he should have gone to the executive leadership and made his concerns known. But that doesn’t have the emotional wallop of chagrining a cop for his ego.



Well Sarge... YOU swore to uphold the law and the Constitution of the U.S. to the best of your ability; not hide behind FOIA requests, lie about supervisory orders, sit on your duff over technicalities, and retard public safety calls as retribution. I do hope, that you sir, are not part of my local constabulary.

YOU BETTER HOPE MR. SEIM DOESN’T GET TO WRITE THE RULES FOR YOUR CONSTABULARY.

3.) “Well Sarge... YOU swore to uphold the law and the Constitution of the U.S. to the best of your ability;” I do. By department R’s & P’s and my union agreement, It is also my duty to uphold my department’s image and I have a right to protect my reputation from ridicule, or be forced to endure the harassment of nonsense acts. That means I don’t have be a sock puppet in some buffoon’s video. I don’t have to answer questions not directly related to my job at my level. I only have to ID myself by name, shield number and command [Pct.] when in uniform. There’s a name plate with my last name on it under my shield which has a unique number. I don’t have to spell it for you, give you a pen to write it down, or provide any other form of ID.

4.) “not hide behind FOIA requests” My dept. has a public information officer. He is the official voice of the department. The R’s & P’s state that no one is to make any statements about the department, its policies & procedures, any investigation, release any work product, or make any comments or statements unless it had been cleared by the PIO. This is to preclude the release of false, misleading, confusing or incorrect information.

There are also privacy act laws and dept. policies which precluded the release of complainant/victim/witness information for obvious reasons. Any arrest information is of course public information, but that doesn’t mean I can release it to anyone who asks. How would you feel if I responded to Mr. Seim with information about a sexual assault that happened to a family member of yours? The dept. has established a mechanism for releasing this info and I have to follow it. So Im not hiding behind anything.

5.) “lie about supervisory orders” Do you mean the car marking regulations? I’m not expected to know them. And if assigned an unmarked car by my patrol Sgt.,in violation of said code, he assumes the onus of the violation, not me. And for the “I was just following orders” is not an excuse crowd, this is at best a violation of an administrative code section, not a Nuremburg class felony.

6.) “sit on your duff over technicalities, and retard public safety calls as retribution.” My dept.’s R’s & P’s and my contract say if my sector car is pulled out of service for mechanical or other reasons I am to be reassigned according to the needs of the dept. That’s not sitting on my duff over a technicality, or retarding calls for service in retribution. That would be the absurd result if the Seim’s of this world were actually empowered to act on their lunatic ideas. Or do you actually think I’d get sent home with ½ a days pay?

7.)"No wonder people dislike cops." Yeh my dad always said if you wanted to be liked become a firefighter or medic. However, I don't run my life like a popularity contest. IDGAD who likes or dislikes me. I only care about going home at the end of my tour.

I appreciate the POV you provide, however, please notice the sentence I put in bold.

While I understand the desire to return home at the end of your tour (I've had my share in places like Afghanistan & Iraq), is there a line you aren't willing to cross for that? Perhaps I'm looking too far into this but, if the "only" thing you care about is going home at the the end of your shift, you may be in the wrong line of work. You're priority should be protecting the citizenry, serving your community and upholding Constitutional law, no?

Additionally, arguing about the manner in which Mr. Seim informed the officer of wrong doing according to the law, is much the same as people arguing over concealed vs. open carry. Who cares? What matters is that in both instances, these individuals are exercising their Rights in different ways. Much in the same way that every police officer would tell a citizen that ignorance of the law is no excuse, the same applies ten-fold for those intrusted with upholding those laws. As a servant of the community, that officer is the conduit between the citizens and their government, like it or not. Every officer is a representative of said department and government, both of which are to be answerable to the People at all times.

Lastly, perhaps with the near-daily instances of LEOs bending and/or breaking the laws the citizens would be punished for, it seems Mr. Seim has said to himself, "Not one more inch!".

Cheers
 
As long as the citizen can't enforce the law this is meaningless. I bet the same cop is driving the same car today.

The proper way to address this is through local government
 
As long as the citizen can't enforce the law this is meaningless. I bet the same cop is driving the same car today.

The proper way to address this is through local government

The cop allowed the consensual interaction, and though amused and dismissive at first, ended up being receptive to what Seim was saying and actually learned something by actively participating in his own education when he printed and confirmed for himself that he was being told the truth.

I find the video to be a rather profound departure from what we expect to see from cops, and SGT504MP's posts to legitimize and validate those expectations.

By the way, Seim's YouTube channel confirms that he does indeed address his concerns through local and state government as well.

Blues
 
As long as the citizen can't enforce the law this is meaningless. I bet the same cop is driving the same car today.

The proper way to address this is through local government

It is rather unfortunate that you view it that way. While I don't doubt for a second that the officer drove the same vehicle during his next shift, perhaps even today, I find the event anything but meaningless. I find it profound and encouraging, however unimportant it may be to the larger picture.
 
While I understand the desire to return home at the end of your tour (I've had my share in places like Afghanistan & Iraq), is there a line you aren't willing to cross for that? Perhaps I'm looking too far into this but, if the "only" thing you care about is going home at the the end of your shift, you may be in the wrong line of work.


Mr. GBob, you are looking waay to far into my last sentence. And this has nothing to do with the debate about concealed-open carry, and everything you said about being responsible and answerable to the people I serve. And after detailing the reasons why I have every right not to be forced into this clowns circus act - Mr. BS’s snark aside, I’ll provide another reason - this guy is stealing from you.


Mr. Seim fraudulently accosted that deputy under the guise of needing assistance - selfishly preventing the deputy from providing assistance to a person who might have actually have needed it - and then took five minutes of his time delivering meaningless drivel about some obscure section of Washington State VTL code governing the marking of police vehicles not relevant to that deputy’s job.


Doesn’t sound like much, unless you look at it like this?


That’s five extra minutes a grandparent would have to wait for medical assistance, five extra minutes a drunk or reckless driver would be on the road with someone’s wife, five extra minutes a rapist gets with his victim, a robbery suspect gets to murder a witness or make his getaway, well you get the idea. Imagine a battalion of these “activists” badgering cops all day long over whatever minutiae they can find in all the chapters of the law, or the minor, everyday transgressions of the law WE ALL DO while going about our daily lives. That would start to add up to lots of “lost” time and money.


“I've had my share in places like Afghanistan & Iraq”


I had my share at the WTC. It seems our careers bookend the GWOT. I spent part of September, 2001 loading rubble into pay-loaders and body parts into spackle buckets.


This is good stuff, even more reasons to dislike cops.


I’m on a roll. One more dislike and I get a toaster.
 
I had my share at the WTC. It seems our careers bookend the GWOT. I spent part of September, 2001 loading rubble into pay-loaders and body parts into spackle buckets.

And 99% of the time that is exactly when the police show up....to take witness statements after the crime has been committed. So, really....delayed 5 minutes? Yeah, delayed 5 minutes from answering the call of the victim AFTER the crime has been committed.
 
And 99% of the time that is exactly when the police show up....to take witness statements after the crime has been committed. So, really....delayed 5 minutes? Yeah, delayed 5 minutes from answering the call of the victim AFTER the crime has been committed.



Sorry my dept. hasn’t issued me a crystal ball, but you can say the same thing about firefighters and EMT’s. F.Y.I. about 40% of my arrests when I was on patrol or street crime were pick-up arrests – an arrest made as the crime was in progress, or immediately afterwards.
 
And 99% of the time that is exactly when the police show up....to take witness statements after the crime has been committed. So, really....delayed 5 minutes? Yeah, delayed 5 minutes from answering the call of the victim AFTER the crime has been committed.



Sorry my dept. hasn’t issued me a crystal ball, but you can say the same thing about firefighters and EMT’s. F.Y.I. about 40% of my arrests when I was on patrol or street crime were pick-up arrests – an arrest made as the crime was in progress, or immediately afterwards.

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