CHL holder causes problems for "occupy", gets arrested

[DemocratGunOwner]

Link Removed

Long story short: Someone went to go pester "hippie camp" here in Portland, got called a racial slur, flashed his (legally CHL carried) gun.

Not going to help CHL holders there, bub. Now he's charged and can lose his CHL.

Regardless of your view of the "Occupy" movement (and here in Portland, it has pretty much lost all significance as part of "Occupy," and is now pretty much just, as I call it, "hippie camp,") flashing your gun is STUPID. Racial slur or not (what about those comparisons to the Tea Party?) if you're not being physically threatened, DON'T PULL YOUR GUN!

(And if you ARE in a situation that you're being threatened, don't flash it - PULL IT!)

Edit: Ah, just saw a news story that included video of the incident. Apparently the Occupy people came and confronted HIM after he started taking pictures. He argued back. They didn't show much of the argument, just that they were arguing (amateur video.) Apparently he was then called a racial slur (he is black,) then "flashed" his gun. It is unclear what level of "flash" it was. He was booked on "Disorderly Conduct".

Still stupid to flash the gun.

 

[Glock Fan]

Link Removed

Long story short: Someone went to go pester "hippie camp" here in Portland, got called a racial slur, flashed his (legally CHL carried) gun.

Not going to help CHL holders there, bub. Now he's charged and can lose his CHL.

Regardless of your view of the "Occupy" movement (and here in Portland, it has pretty much lost all significance as part of "Occupy," and is now pretty much just, as I call it, "hippie camp,") flashing your gun is STUPID. Racial slur or not (what about those comparisons to the Tea Party?) if you're not being physically threatened, DON'T PULL YOUR GUN!

(And if you ARE in a situation that you're being threatened, don't flash it - PULL IT!)

Edit: Ah, just saw a news story that included video of the incident. Apparently the Occupy people came and confronted HIM after he started taking pictures. He argued back. They didn't show much of the argument, just that they were arguing (amateur video.) Apparently he was then called a racial slur (he is black,) then "flashed" his gun. It is unclear what level of "flash" it was. He was booked on "Disorderly Conduct".

Still stupid to flash the gun.

The idiot is lucky that "disorderly conduct" was the only thing he was charged with. :-(

 

[Tucker's Mom]

Maybe it is a set-up to sully the legally gun-totting community? another small ploy to make a big excuse later on to move to remove our guns? Baby steps... Who knows? These "OCCUPY...OCCUPY...OCCUPY..." are really well-organized. The welfare people are "there for the food", the street beggars do not have to beg for food and shelter -- they are among their kinds -- hence there is no rhyme and only stupid reasons why they are involved in the "revolt"? It's all crazy out there. Just my thoughts...

 

[wuzfuz]

In Arizona, the charge would be Misconduct Involving a Weapon. There was an incident in Pierce County, WA a while back. Washington is an Open Carry state, but some LEOs don't seem to understand what Open Carry means. A gentleman was getting his daily latte at Starbuck's, as he had been doing for two years, wearing his 9mm on his hip. a deputy sheriff approached and demanded his ID. The man said the deputy had no reson to harass him, as he was doing nothing wrong. Here, the story gets murky. According to KIRO TV News, the man was arrested for Disorderly Conduct. And the spokesman for the department stated the police have the right to investigate a possible threat. I made contact with the department, seeking follow-up to the story. I was told there was no arrest, the deputy checked his ID and went on his way. The TV coverage and statements by witnesses disagree, but that is the official story. My question (s) (I have a few) is: How does a citizen exercising his rights constitute a threat? Why is the man's (or my) weapon a threat? Is my sidearm a threat where the depity's isn't? I am a former LEO, have been through more background checks than the majority of the population, and have had CCW licensea in Arizona and have a CPL in Waashington. My weapon, just like the one the deputy carries is sworn to the protection of myself or an innocent third party. There must be something in the water here in Washington, but we have had five or six police officers murdered recently, and a number of shootings, including an armored car guard shot in the head in a WalMart. I do not intend to be a victim.

 

[Deserteagle]

Link Removed

Long story short: Someone went to go pester "hippie camp" here in Portland, got called a racial slur, flashed his (legally CHL carried) gun.

Not going to help CHL holders there, bub. Now he's charged and can lose his CHL.

Regardless of your view of the "Occupy" movement (and here in Portland, it has pretty much lost all significance as part of "Occupy," and is now pretty much just, as I call it, "hippie camp,") flashing your gun is STUPID. Racial slur or not (what about those comparisons to the Tea Party?) if you're not being physically threatened, DON'T PULL YOUR GUN!

(And if you ARE in a situation that you're being threatened, don't flash it - PULL IT!)

Edit: Ah, just saw a news story that included video of the incident. Apparently the Occupy people came and confronted HIM after he started taking pictures. He argued back. They didn't show much of the argument, just that they were arguing (amateur video.) Apparently he was then called a racial slur (he is black,) then "flashed" his gun. It is unclear what level of "flash" it was. He was booked on "Disorderly Conduct".

Still stupid to flash the gun.

Wait a second, the people from the "moron" thread say its perfectly fine to wave your gun around...
Once again to the confused people out there, guns are not for pointing at people, flashing at people, or verbally threatening people with, its called menacing/ brandishing.

 

[Derby]

Agreed that if it was an intentional flash, it was foolish. If it was unintentional, it was careless.

 

[Nightmare45]

I do not flash a weapon even if involved in verbal contest, if under physical threat weapon will be pulled while speed dialing 911.

 

[tuts40]

Maybe it is a set-up to sully the legally gun-totting community? another small ploy to make a big excuse later on to move to remove our guns? Baby steps... Who knows? These "OCCUPY...OCCUPY...OCCUPY..." are really well-organized. The welfare people are "there for the food", the street beggars do not have to beg for food and shelter -- they are among their kinds -- hence there is no rhyme and only stupid reasons why they are involved in the "revolt"? It's all crazy out there. Just my thoughts...

Good thought there on the possibility of a 'set up'. Kinda like Fast & Furious that was intended to hang American gun owners but went bust, but this mighta been a F&F light having been only one guy, if one subscribes to the idea of this being a set up.

 

[DemocratGunOwner]

eh, I have to walk by the "Occupy Portland" camp every day on my way to work. The camp is definitely a mix of "serious protesters", "general hippies", and "homeless camping in an area they know isn't going to be kicked out soon." The problem (for them) is that the serious protesters are outnumbered. They exist, and from what a co-worker who goes down there (as a serious protester) tells me, they *ARE* starting to get their act together, but it's still an uphill battle for the serious ones.

I also see plenty of anti-Occupy people wandering by. I *MIGHT* have seen this offender before, and if it is who I saw before, I'm pretty sure this isn't a set up. I mean, even if it were a cause I was completely for, I wouldn't risk going to jail and losing my CHL just to make opponents of my cause look bad. Going to jail to support a cause is one thing, going to jail to frame a cause is something else. (Plus, I don't think Occupy (at least here in Portland,) has expressed any anti-gun sentiment, so it wouldn't make sense for a CHL holder to sabotage CHL holders in this attempt. The 'counter-protester' hasn't even publicly expressed any alternate-to-Occupy views publicly, so it's not like he is obviously aligned with any other specific cause.

Now if he hadn't flashed a gun, and just got in an old-fashioned fistfight, while holding a "Tea Party Patriot" sign (or other obvious flamboyantly-displaying-a-counter-group sign,) then I might buy that he was a set-up.

 

[leadsender]

You may not agree with those so called "hippie Camp" people or the occupy movement but, they have just as much a right to do what they are doing as we the concealed or open carry people do what we do. As a matter of fact; we have more of a responsibility because we know that certain people would like to take away what we have. I happen to be a black person also and for this guy to pull up his shirt and show his gun was STUPID. Legally, it could be considered brandishing. I am not going to do anything to give an opportunity to have my CPL/CCW taken away.

 

[DemocratGunOwner]

Actually, I agree with the *origin* of the occupy movement, it's just that the movement here in Portland seems to have been derailed and turned into "hippie camp", as I call it. Hopefully they can get organized again, and make it something with political statement again.

I see the movement as very similar to the Tea Party, another movement I supported when it first started. But the Tea Party got taken over by extremists with different plans (the Koch brothers,) and now its public image is one I can't support. I'm sure there are still people who call themselves "Tea Party Patriots" with whom I would agree. But they need to clarify their message and return to what they started as. (The group trying to convince small businesses to sabotage the economy *SOLELY* to punish one political party is completely ridiculous.)

I'm just worried that the same thing will happen to Occupy. (And by some reports, it's already starting to happen at Occupy Wall Street...)

 

[PaxMentis]

Since he didn't draw the gun and (even in the Oregon portion of the Portland/Seattle Peoples State) a CHL holder can open carry, I really doubt he will get convicted.

Down in S. Oregon (at least in my county), he wouldn't even get arrested.

 

[walt629]

To refer to another posting... prime example of 'brandishing' and he got what he deserved.

Sounds like the type of knucklehead I wouldn't want to be associated with.

 

[walt629]

Since he didn't draw the gun and (even in the Oregon portion of the Portland/Seattle Peoples State) a CHL holder can open carry, I really doubt he will get convicted.

Down in S. Oregon (at least in my county), he wouldn't even get arrested.

Which begs the question: If, even in an OC state, a person with a concealed weapon, in this case, lifts his shirt to show off the weapon in a fashion short of "hey! I got a new gun. You wanna see it?", is he guilty of menacing? What about brandishing?

 

[walt629]

Actually, I agree with the *origin* of the occupy movement, it's just that the movement here in Portland seems to have been derailed and turned into "hippie camp", as I call it. Hopefully they can get organized again, and make it something with political statement again.

I see the movement as very similar to the Tea Party, another movement I supported when it first started. But the Tea Party got taken over by extremists with different plans (the Koch brothers,) and now its public image is one I can't support. I'm sure there are still people who call themselves "Tea Party Patriots" with whom I would agree. But they need to clarify their message and return to what they started as. (The group trying to convince small businesses to sabotage the economy *SOLELY* to punish one political party is completely ridiculous.)

I'm just worried that the same thing will happen to Occupy. (And by some reports, it's already starting to happen at Occupy Wall Street...)

I'm not starting a fight here, I actually agree with most of the 99ers also, even though I do not agree with the founders of the OWS movement. Did you their demands? Clearly the founders of the movement are from academia and have no clue how the economic world really operates. With the invasion by Soros and the unions the movement is being perverted by extremism, just like the TEA Party.

It wasn't until I read an article from one of the late-comers to that movement that I understood what "99%" stood for. When I saw these people on the tube I thought I had noting to do with these morons, then I came to understand the "99%" stand for the 99% of the population that are not Billionaires. Now it make sense.

The movement is still full of kids that want their school loans forgiven and homeowners that think the government owes them a bailout but I believe (not a proven fact, I just like to believe) that the majority of the people are frustrated with the direction our nation has taken and want a change to come.

From my stand point I agree. A change needs to come.

 

[Glock Fan]

Since he didn't draw the gun and (even in the Oregon portion of the Portland/Seattle Peoples State) a CHL holder can open carry, I really doubt he will get convicted.

Down in S. Oregon (at least in my county), he wouldn't even get arrested.

In this case it would depend on the "totality of circumstances". Dude gets into a verbal confrontation with a couple of other dudes. The dude then realizes that it's highly likely he's gonna get his @$$ handed to him. To "even the score" the dude displays his firearm. This would be more than enough in most jurisdictions for him to get arrested.

Carrying a firearm is a HUGE responsibility which comes with many other related responsibilities. The firearm is for SELF DEFENSE. If you willfully engage in a shouting match and let it escalate to the point that you're about to get your @$$ whipped, then you have very poor judgment and have no business carrying. A lot of CC folks need to learn to walk away. It's taken me many years, however I'm at the point where I'll do whatever I can to get away from trouble and avoid having to draw my firearm.

Bottom line is the guy deserved to get hooked. Will he get convicted? Who knows. Will it cost him a bunch of time and money? Certainly. Would he have been better off walking away? Most likely.

 

[PaxMentis]

Which begs the question: If, even in an OC state, a person with a concealed weapon, in this case, lifts his shirt to show off the weapon in a fashion short of "hey! I got a new gun. You wanna see it?", is he guilty of menacing? What about brandishing?

Not sure about other places, but one must draw the weapon to "brandish" here.

Hence the disorderly conduct charge...he'll either contest and it will most likely get dropped (like DC charges Portland has tried on CHL holders OCing) or he won't bother and will pay a fine...and keep his license either way. Non domestic misdemeanors aren't grounds to pull the ticket here.