Chicago hits 500 homicides. So much for the effectiveness of gun control.

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On Thursday, officials with the Chicago Police Department said the city was one homicide away from the 500 mark. Hours later, a 40-year-old man was fatally shot in the Austin neighborhood on the city's West Side.

So because Chicago and a few other cities with major gun control laws in place can't make it work, the obvious answer is to make the entire country pay.
 
Cities are cesspools. The bigger the city, the more foul.
Laws can't change that. The only thing that can change that is to somehow develop a moral population.

Good luck with that.
 
Hmm Houston is currently or nearly passing up Chicago as the nations 3rd largest city and yet has half or less homicide...wonder what the big difference might be.
 
Why don't we just outlaw big cities? Or enact a Big Cities Control? Our current set of lawmakers have no common sense, and a lot of the sheep are right along with them.
 
Why don't we just outlaw big cities? Or enact a Big Cities Control? Our current set of lawmakers have no common sense, and a lot of the sheep are right along with them.

Yeah the audacity of Congress astounds me. The same brilliant people who are incapable of balancing the nation's checkbook are going to come up with a plan for common sense gun regulation. *eyeroll*
 
Why don't we just outlaw big cities? Or enact a Big Cities Control? Our current set of lawmakers have no common sense, and a lot of the sheep are right along with them.
We've got Big Government control - it's called the Constitution - but Big Government keeps ignoring it....
 
I'm so glad I moved from there 6 years ago. Much happier and healthier where I live now,, Northwoods. I lived 2 doors down from a gangbangers house. My ex-wifes (wife at the time) car got shot at twice, because it looked similar to one of the gangbangers car. I'm sure that gun was bought legaly (not).
 
We've got Big Government control - it's called the Constitution - but Big Government keeps ignoring it....

And big government keeps ignoring it because ignorant citizens continue to elect legislators who promise to continue ignoring it.

Actually, that isn't entirely true.

EDITED - ADDED

The problem is that those who were sworn to uphold it - going all the way back to George Washington - hijacked it.

From the very beginning of our government a war was fought.

On one side stood Jefferson, Madison, and the Anti-Federalists. They believed (indeed, Jefferson and Madison, the two main authors of the Constitution, explicitly worded the Constitution with these goals in mind) in a small, general purpose government with a set of very clearly defined authorities. Having just won a war against a large, centralized government, they were rightfully concerned about the possibility of seeing a similarly all-powerful, centralized government being established in the US - so much so, that when Jefferson and Madison drafted the Bill of Rights (which passed both the US AND State legislatures with a supermajority), they included these words in the Tenth Amendment:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

On the other side stood Washington and the Federalists. They believed strongly in a centralized government. Washington's own beliefs regarding the correct interpretation of the Constitution were stated in the circular letter he sent to the governors of the states on the eve of his retirement from public office:

"...to take up the great question which has been frequently agitated ⎯ whether it be expedient and requisite for the States to delegate a larger proportion of Power to Congress or not ⎯ yet it will be a part of my duty and that of every true Patriot to assert without reserve and to insist upon the following positions:

That unless the States will suffer [permit] Congress to exercise those prerogatives [that] they are undoubtedly invested with by the Constitution [Articles of Confederation], everything must very rapidly tend to Anarchy and confusion;

That it is indispensable to the happiness of the individual States that there should be lodged somewhere a Supreme Power [executive] to regulate and govern the general concerns of the Confederated Republic, without which the Union cannot be of long duration.

That there must be a faithful and pointed compliance on the part of every State with the late [recent] proposals and demands of Congress, or the most fatal consequences will ensue;

That whatever measures have a tendency to dissolve the Union, or contribute to violate or lessen the Sovereign Authority, ought to be considered as hostile to the Liberty and Independence of America, and the Authors of them treated accordingly..."

Washington stood for a centralized, all-powerful government, which, according to his letter, required that the People and the States "...forget their local prejudices and policies, to make those mutual concessions which are requisite to the general prosperity, and in some instances to sacrifice their individual advantages to the interest of the Community." Where the Bill of Rights reserved the majority of powers to the People and the States, Washington called on both entities to concede more of those powers and authorities to the federal government whenever the legislature called upon them to do so. To resist such a request or to take steps to limit (or diminish) the supreme authority of the federal government was a crime that "...will merit the bitterest execration [hatred and contempt] and the severest punishment which can be inflicted by his injured Country." In other words, the Tenth Amendment was to be ignored in favor of the Necessary and Proper clause of the Constitution. It was Washington who declared that revolution as a means of changing a tyrannical government was no longer an option since the founding of our republic:

"If, in the opinion of the people, the distribution or modification of the constitutional powers be in any particular wrong, let it be corrected by an amendment in the way which the Constitution designates. But let there be no change by usurpation; for though this, in one instance, may be the instrument of good, it is the customary weapon by which free governments are destroyed."

The meaning was clear: revolting against a monarchy, as HE had done, was a good thing, but the AMENDMENT was the only proper way to effect change in a republic. By taking revolution off the table as a legitimate means of changing a government that had become so corrupt that it could not be changed by means of legislation or amendments, he also negated the Second Amendment - which was intended by Jefferson and Madison to be a safeguard against a corrupt and tyrannical government.

And since Washington was the first President of the US, who also appointed the first Supreme Court justices, the Federalist interpretation of the Constitution is the one that became the norm for the government. It is the understanding under which our legislature and the President operate. And it is this hijacked interpretation of the Constitution that permits the federal government to confiscate more of the rights that were reserved to US whenever the urge hits, all in the name of the "Necessary and Proper" clause and national security.

No, the Constitution didn't fail; it was hijacked by those who swore to uphold and defend it.
 
Been to Chicago in the early 80s running an alarm service. The cops were more scary than the crooks. I never worried about working on an alarm at 2:00 am and finding bad guys, but walking outside and running into the police. UGH!!! I am sure the police had their issues with us being there at 2:00 am working at a closed business.
 
Well it seems like your country is having a sort of experiment. Trying strong gun control in places like Washington DC and Illinois and virtually no gun control in places like Vermont. (Correct me if I've got my places wrong.) Surely now is a good time to have a "tally-up", see which system seems safest then adopt that before too many more people are needlessly killed or injured?

If it is not gun control but some other factor that makes places safe or not safe then perhaps you could do some more experimentation with "other factors".

Isn't this just logic?
Chicago, D.C. and New York were no experiments. The human degenerate excrement in those cities murder, and will continue to murder, no matter laws thither and yon, today or tomorrow, never. Those metropolitan areas (and many more here) are overrun by drug traffic, corruption, murders, rapes, robberies, and other unspeakable atrocities. The criminal element in those areas don't heed laws, or experiments. Even trusted guardians of the cities are corrupt. Organized crime in metropolitan America is firmly entrenched, and nothing short of all out war in the streets is going to make a damn bit of difference. I foresee curfews, Marshall law, Police State within those cities overrun by this scum. Threats of firearm confiscation will make no difference to the criminals! They will run rampant with glee, as they will be the only ones with firearms, to prey on the recently disarmed, law-abiding public.

This is always governments' fix-it; disarm law-abiding citizens with feel-good, pat-on-the-back, attaboy laws that leave honest citizens defenseless against the effluent. Crime involving criminals with firearms goes up, and politicians/government are left scratching their heads at what possibly could have gone wrong?

I'm going to go out on a limb and say our present attacks on law-abiding citizens rights to protect themselves against multiple intruders with appropriate defense, while not directly related to our 2nd amendment, is the most egregious, and idiotic piece of legislation I have seen in my 57 years as an American.

Diane Feinstein's AWB, with all the hundreds of attached stipulations is ludicrous insanity. She must be stopped, if we want to protect ourselves from multiple intruders in our own homes. She won't stop until all of America is disarmed, left to criminals armed to the teeth, preying on our society, as easily as shooting fish in a rain barrel.

As far as any more experiments in our metropolitan areas that work; there are none. Marshall Law, Police State, Executive Order, are just around the corner in those areas. I fear some watered-down equivalent will be shoved-down our throats, possibly involving Executive Order, in more rural areas.

Logic will have nothing to do with how our government operates from here onward. The battle lines have been drawn in the sand, and we'll see what shakes-out of the mess.

As an American citizen, I am worried about civil unrest in some areas, leading to needless casualties to enforcers, and civilians. I pray it doesn't come to that, and consider that a worst case scenario. We cannot let that happen. It will rip this country apart at the already frayed seams.

I'm of the ilk that I always envision worst case scenarios, and if they don't happen, I'm relieved and thankful for it, in the end.

I'm emotionally drained since the CT massacre. I've cried, wept silently, prayed for the dead, families, relatives and witnesses to this atrocity, and of course all the others that have happened not so long ago.

We seem hell-bent on attacking the wrong cause, instead of putting blame squarely on government for their gun free zones (killing fields), and total lack of responsibility for not appointing officers in our schools, as are already in our county, state and federal buildings. Blame innocent society for the atrocities that government is criminally culpable for. That is our present administration's mantra. And it sickens me to the core. When do the criminally insane get blamed for their actions? When? WHEN?
 
Well it seems like your country is having a sort of experiment. Trying strong gun control in places like Washington DC and Illinois and virtually no gun control in places like Vermont. (Correct me if I've got my places wrong.) Surely now is a good time to have a "tally-up", see which system seems safest then adopt that before too many more people are needlessly killed or injured?

If it is not gun control but some other factor that makes places safe or not safe then perhaps you could do some more experimentation with "other factors".

Isn't this just logic?

Sure - you tell me which approach tallies up the best (index numbers as of 2008, the latest year for which I was able to find stats on short notice):

Washington DC murders per 100,000 population - 17.5; Violent crime - 1 highest in the nation; murder - #1; rape - #26; robbery - #1; aggravated assault - #1

Illinois murders per 100,000 population - 5.6; Violent crime - 12th highest in the nation; murder - #16; rape - #25; robbery - #7; aggravated assault - #18

Vermont murders per 100,000 population - 1.3. Violent crime - #50; murder - #38; rape - #45; robbery - #50; aggravated assault - #49

So you tell me - Washington DC, Illinois, with strict gun control, Vermont almost no gun control: which approach seems to "tally-up" the best?
 
Well I was already aware of those statistics. That was my point. I just could not understand the thought process of the anti gun people. Are they selectively blind? What do they respond when made aware of those figures?

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

They respond by ignoring the facts and appealing to the fear of what MIGHT happen. WHAT IF someone with a CPL loses it and goes on a shooting spree (argumentum ad baculum - appeal to fear)? Or they make the argument that high numbers of firearms ownership in general MUST lead to higher crime rates (Hoc, ergo propter hoc - after this, therefore because of this). And they ALWAYS throw in a good character smear (ALL NRA members are...., ALL CPL holders.....) - a good old fashioned ad hominem (attack the person) attack. What just happened in Michigan is a prime example. The state legislature passed a bill that would have given CPL holders the right to carry in pistol free zones (I'm simplifying it here - there was more to it). The governor vetoed it. Why? Because he personally sees no benefit in defensive carry based on a murder that took place 30 years ago. He KNOWS the facts. CPL holders in Michigan, according to the objective data, are the most law-abiding people in the state, and he offered nothing to counter the objective data. But because of his personal fears, he vetoed the bill.

What it boils down to is this: their minds are made up. 1) High numbers of guns owned MUST inevitably lead to high rates of firearms-related crime (again, not differentiating between legal/illegal gun ownership and ignoring readily available FBI and other law enforcement data that demonstrate a clear relationship between high numbers of legal firearms ownership/carry and corresponding reductions of violent crime). 2) Only those who have been specifically trained to fulfill a law enforcement role can be trusted with the use of deadly force (even though the objective data show that one is 5-1/2 times more likely to be shot accidentally by a police officer than by a civilian with a CPL); the average gun owner, therefore, is just a wannabe Rambo itching for an opportunity to bust a cap in someone's head. 3) The role of Big Brother is to protect us from all danger - real and imaginary, therefore there is no need for the average individual to carry a firearm for their own protection. 4) This isn't the wild west; man is basically good and society has evolved past the point where firearms carry is necessary. So as I said earlier, they ignore the objective data and stir up the fear.
 

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