CCW shooting info request

[LongPurple]

I'm a new member starting off with a call for help.

I am trying to find whatever information is available on the following shooting incident ---

A CCW holder was charged with murder in the street shooting of another man.
The CCW holder was deaf, reportedly beyond the ability to hear at all, even with a hearing-aid. The shooting happened in Florida.

That is all the information I have on the incident, and google searches have not turned up any more. If I knew the city, I would try newspaper sites.

Any information, especially with referal to sources, would be appreciated.

 

[kelcarry]

Do not have an answer to your question but my first thought is how the heck do you get a CCWP when all your senses are not available. Why not give the CCWP to a blind person, as well? Has the Disabilities Act gone so crazy that it intrudes on the safety of people when you can get a CCWP if you are deaf? It figures it would be FL, the home of the looney seniors who somehow feel they are just as capable of doing everything as everyone else--even if they can't (I am 69 so don't preach to me about intolerance--if you have not seen what some seniors get away with, particularly in FL, you have your eyes closed). Do not know the case but if I am on a jury and you tell me because you were deaf you ended up killing someone who should not have been killed, I will tell you that you are guilty of manslaughter.

 

[ClearSightTactical]

Do not have an answer to your question but my first thought is how the heck do you get a CCWP when all your senses are not available. Why not give the CCWP to a blind person, as well? Has the Disabilities Act gone so crazy that it intrudes on the safety of people when you can get a CCWP if you are deaf? It figures it would be FL, the home of the looney seniors who somehow feel they are just as capable of doing everything as everyone else--even if they can't (I am 69 so don't preach to me about intolerance--if you have not seen what some seniors get away with, particularly in FL, you have your eyes closed). Do not know the case but if I am on a jury and you tell me because you were deaf you ended up killing someone who should not have been killed, I will tell you that you are guilty of manslaughter.

Oh my, lol.

I think a person with physical disability are more likely to be attacked. There should be some interesting debate on this...

 

[oldbanjo]

Kelcarry I think if you check you'll find that a blind person can get a CWP in SC.

 

[ClearSightTactical]

Kelcarry I think if you check you'll find that a blind person can get a CWP in SC.

Ok, I have to ask...how? I completely understand the need, but how, I mean legally, or morally. I'm just a bit confused by blind I don't mean "legally blind" I mean BLIND as in cannot see anything. Really?

 

[Kasper]

For one simply reason when you lose one of your 5 sense the other four will become stronger. Blind people sense of touch is better and so is their hearing. As for being deaf that does not affect your ability to shoot a gun or rifle. It just means no need to buy hearing protection.

 

[ClearSightTactical]

For one simply reason when you lose one of your 5 sense the other four will become stronger. Blind people sense of touch is better and so is their hearing. As for being deaf that does not affect your ability to shoot a gun or rifle. It just means no need to buy hearing protection.

Well, while that may be true I don't know that the increase in other senses would be able to determine the factors of a deadly force encounter. I am speaking purely of blind. How can a blind person legitimately be confident that they are shooting the right person?

 

[oldbanjo]

I may have a answer in a couple of hours on the blind person getting a CWP. The Gun shop made a phone call and was told that he should be able to get one, I'll check and see if he did in fact get one.

 

[kelcarry]

Bottom line for me is that if you are deaf and you end up killing someone who you "thought" was a threat in some fashion because you are deaf, you have an awful lot of explaining to do both on legal and civil grounds. You cannot explain away a terrible mistake by telling me on a jury that it is because you could not hear. I just find it to be a bit ludicrous and explaining away not hearing what is going on around you and assuming you can make all the right decisions at anytime under any circumstances to be argumentative. Having said that, if the law says you can--have at it--I still will shake my head.

 

[oldbanjo]

The guy that's blind is still waiting for an answer from Sled.

 

[S&W645]

SECTION 23-31-215. Issuance of permits.
(A) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, except subject to subsection (B) of this section, SLED must issue a permit, which is no larger than three and one-half inches by three inches in size, to carry a concealable weapon to a resident or qualified nonresident who is at least twenty-one years of age and who is not prohibited by state law from possessing the weapon upon submission of:

(1) a completed application signed by the person;

(2) one current full face color photograph of the person, not smaller than one inch by one inch nor larger than three inches by five inches;

(3) proof of residence or if the person is a qualified nonresident, proof of ownership of real property in this State;

(4) proof of actual or corrected vision rated at 20/40 within six months of the date of application or, in the case of a person licensed to operate a motor vehicle in this State, presentation of a valid driver's license;

Taken from the scstatehouse.gov website. As you can see, no pun intended, a blind person cannot get a SC Concealed Carry Permit.

What is required in SC to get a DL? Link Removed

You must see well enough to drive.

So can a person be legally blind and get a DL which would allow you to get a CWP? SC Eye exam form only spells it out for CDL.

VISION REQUIREMENTS FOR A COMMERCIAL DRIVER'S LICENSE (PART 391.41)
1. At least 20/40 or better each eye with or without corrective lens

You can get a Fed waiver that takes it to 20/60 but restricted to daylight operations. So 20/40 is not the legal limit of vision to get a SC CWP. But even 20/60 fails to meet the legal definition of blindness which sets it at 20/200 in the best eye corrected. So it would be real hard for a blind person to get it in SC.

 

[[email protected]]

Deaf Yes. Blind No

 

[Booga]

Bottom line for me is that if you are deaf and you end up killing someone who you "thought" was a threat in some fashion because you are deaf, you have an awful lot of explaining to do both on legal and civil grounds.

Being deaf does not mean you're stupid or incapable of assessing a dangerous situation. We need more information before any judgment can be made about the scenario described by the OP.

Speaking of... I only found two cases where deaf people used guns to shoot at people. Only in one case was someone killed. Neither was in Florida.

In that case, the deaf person appears to have been intentionally targeting people.
Link: Link Removed

As you can see, the deaf guy got an incredibly light sentence for voluntary manslaughter.

Hopefully someone else can find the incident the OP is looking for.

 

[handgonnetoter]

I don't see a problem with a deaf person getting a CCW. Lets face it, if a bad guy was real quite, we would not hear them either. Being able to see IS paramount to being able to shoot safely. If you cannot identify your target by sight, then you are not really identifying the target, right? JMHO.

 

[Oldgrunt]

I don't see a problem with a deaf person getting a CCW. Lets face it, if a bad guy was real quite, we would not hear them either. Being able to see IS paramount to being able to shoot safely. If you cannot identify your target by sight, then you are not really identifying the target, right? JMHO.

If his hearing is good, he won't have any problem locating me. Listen for the sound of feet running away from him!!:sarcastic:

 

[LonjgPurple]

A belated thanks to all who replied, even though no one had heard of the incident.

I got a few more details, and a Google search yielded more info.

For the record: the shooter was Ron Melnik, 39 yrs old, not a doddering old man, in fact an ex-football player for North Carolina State and into bodybuilding, martial arts, etc.. Apparently his hearing handicap did not prevent him from participating in team sports. I have not been able to determine if he had a CCW or not.

The shooting occurred at a New Year's Eve party in Fort Lauderdale. There is a lot of highly charged controversy over how the shooting occurred, but any hearing disability does NOT appear to be a factor. The shooter and the dead man have been described as “best friends” , who shared similar interests in all sorts of physical fitness and sports, at least by some accounts. The family and friends of the alleged victim describe him as a saint, which is to be expected. They describe the shooter as Satan, which is also to be expected.

By some accounts, the shooter murdered the victim by drawing a concealed weapon and shooting him several times, and while he lay wounded on the floor of his home, stood over him and fatally shot him again in front of his wife and children. That's what I mean by a Satanic characterization of the shooter. There are other indications that the shooting was outside, when the alleged victim either tried to convince the shooter not to drive, or continued an argument, and was punching the shooter while he was near his car. The shooter was said to have then gotten a pistol out of the glove compartment, and fired.

I have found no information about the trial. We can only hope that the truth will come out in court.

 

[handgonnetoter]

Let me ask you guys this. If you became hard of hearing or deaf, would you change your minds on weather or not you have the ability to defend yourselves from a violent attack, outside of your home? Not being able to see is a no-brainer. The whole concept of being able to shoot is being able to see. When I go to the range, I have ear plugs and muffs on. When someone says something to me I can't hear them at all. I have to take off my ear protection to talk to someone. Not being able to hear does not effect my shooting at all. Just something to think about.

 

[NavyLCDR]

Should someone who is deaf be allowed to purchase/possess a silencer?

 

[kelcarry]

I truly believe that most of the recent replies are playing word games here. Arguments on being blind are ridiculous for CC--stop wasting computer space. Arguments on deaf are somewhat possible but, IMO, it makes for exactly what this thread is all about. If you cannot hear what is going on and only rely on your sight and you make a mistake and someone dies or is seriously injured--c'mon guys--give me a break. It is like the old adage---minor surgery is performed on someone else, major surgery is performed on me. Being deaf and shooting someone else seems to be something we can argue about UNLESS that someone turns out to be you.