CC in church

[swidener]

Does anyone here cc in their church? I am a deacon at my church and asked my pastor a while back how he felt about one of his parishioners carrying a concealed weapon, and to my surprise this was his answer: "I personally would not condone it, but if someone were to conceal carry I wouldn't know about it now would I"? With that said, another deacon of the church and myself have taken the cc class and will have permits within 60 days or so:biggrin:. We have had (as I'm sure any church has) some very interesting characters to just waltz up into the sanctuary in the middle of service and caused some uneasy feelings at times. You never know what people are thinking and what state of mind they are in these days, whether it be for spiritual help or a personal vendetta against the way/WHO you worship. Granted God will protect his people BUT He also gives you a brain and the means to use self defense should the need arise.

 

[tattedupboy]

Fortunately, my home state (Indiana) does not list churches as being one of the locations that are off limits. However, the part of Indiana in which I live (Gary, located in the Northwest corner of the state) is vehemently anti-gun, and I'm certain that asking my pastor would almost certainly result in him saying no. So yes, I do it (legally, I might add), and until there is a sign posted or someone announces that it is not allowed, I'll continue doing it, and no one will ever know about it.

 

[HootmonSccy]

swidener

There is a very long thread on this topic already.. You will see lots of posts on the subject..

 

[Daven]

Yeah, duplicate thread....

But who cares, we can have two, right?

At my church The Sr. Pastor carries, the worship pastor carries, about 7 of the members carry, and I carry.

If a BG comes in, like many have done in the last few years to get revenge on the pastor or someone else, it would be a very bad day for them.

Coincidently, we all sit in different areas of the church, mostly by the exits.

Our Sr. Pastor actually lost one lady who found out he is an NRA member, and "gun nut" and wrote him a letter saying she could not worship there anymore. it was very heart breaking to him, but he put it nicely, if he changed his life on the whim of others, he wouldn't be a good pastor would he?

Gimpy

 

[swidener]

Thanks!

Sorry, I didn’t realize there were other threads in regards to this subject...guess I should have researched a little bit before posting :wacko:...kinda new at this actually. I appreciate the feedback so far as I wanted to get others views and opinions as to what they think and how they "carry" in their church/s. I have an XD40 subcompact with a CQC Serpa holster and was concerned about printing. I guess if you wear a suit/sport coat you could always keep it buttoned up there's not too much to worry about, or is there?...what do you all recommend?

 

[Diamond Dave]

As previously stated, it is important to know your state's law on carrying in church. I live in Ohio where you must be given permission. Our church has a security group who do carry at each service. These individuals work together on planning and processes so that an incident does not turn into the gun battle at OK corral. The also do much more than "securty", being centered on ministering to individuals as well.

 

[swidener]

Right. I live in NC where it is legal to carry in a church as long as there isn't a daycare or school associated with the property. We do have guys that 'act' as security and will check the property/doors during service but that is about it. I like the idea of having 'processes' in place to deal with a situation should the need arise though. As far as I know the other deacon and myself would be the only two that will be carrying...he sits on the front row right in front of the pastor and I sit in the sound booth all the way in the back on a platform about 4' above the congregation (perfect for observation). Thanks for the input...it seems the other deacon and myself need to have some discussion on what our plan would be in case of an altercation...after all being prepared is half the battle right?

 

[swidener]

Daven, that is awesome! Sounds like your whole church leadership carries...you're right, that would make a VERY bad day for the BG!

 

[Bozz]

I personally think it is fine if you carry in Church... its been proven that they are not off-limits to those that want to kill or do harm to others.

If the pastor doesn't forbid it, and the law doesn't either -- then I would do it. If any members of the congregation EVER have to see your gun, they'll be glad you had it!

 

[Treo]

The Bible says that Whatever isn't of faith is sin , the Bible also promises that God didn't give me a Spirit (demonic) of fear but of Power , & Love & of a Sound mind.

If I carry in church because of fear, or because I don't think God can get the Job done ( really one & the same reason) It is a sin for me to carry in church, end of disscussion. If while I'm walking in that Love & a Sound mind that God promised me ( If anybody's gonna carry in church you'd want to be the quy W/ the sound mind right?) I am obedient to what I honestly believe God asked me to do ( this is confirmed by the fact that my Pastor is aware that I carry & never asked me not to) I'm good, I'm right in the middle of the will of God for my life & God will be my shield, my fortress & my deliver. not some gun that I happen to be carrying.

I mean let's be realistic I carry a CZ RAMI in church, me taking out a BG wearing body armor and carrying an AR , would be like, I don't know a teen age sheppard taking out a 9ft tall Giant armed W/ a spear a sword & a shield W/ a slingshot. Never happen .

 

[HootmonSccy]

The Bible says that Whatever isn't of faith is sin , the Bible also promises that God didn't give me a Spirit (demonic) of fear but of Power , & Love & of a Sound mind.

If I carry in church because of fear, or because I don't think God can get the Job done ( really one & the same reason) It is a sin for me to carry in church, end of disscussion. If while I'm walking in that Love & a Sound mind that God promised me ( If anybody's gonna carry in church you'd want to be the quy W/ the sound mind right?) I am obedient to what I honestly believe God asked me to do ( this is confirmed by the fact that my Pastor is aware that I carry & never asked me not to) I'm good, I'm right in the middle of God for my life & God will be my shield, my fortress & my deliver. not some gun that I happen to be carrying.

I mean let's be realistic I carry a CZ RAMI in church, me taking out a BG wearing body armor and carrying an AR , would be like, I don't know a teen age sheppard taking out a 9ft tall Giant armed W/ a spear a sword & a shield W/ a slingshot. Never happen .

Maybe you should read "Shooting Back - The right and duty of Self-defense" by Charl Van Wyk.
He was able to break off an attack by automatic weapon BG's with just a revolver... It also discusses WHY he carried... You might find it interesting.

 

[HootmonSccy]

The terrorist who gunned down George Tiller did so while he was attending his regularly schedualed service at a Lutheran Church in Wichita, Kansas.

Thank you for providing an example to drive home Bozz's point, I don't think an example was necessary, but Thanx anywayz.

 

[swidener]

ALL good points Treo and very true. Fear is sin and basically saying that you do not trust in the mighty hand of God so therefore you will take care of it yourself. Sometimes God does allow situations like this to come into our lives, but in the end and no matter the outcome He will always get the glory. I just want to be prepared for two things: 1) the Second Coming 2) having the ability and the means to protect anothers life.

 

[swidener]

To give an example as to one of the reasons why I decided to cc in the church: We had a lady to stop by right in the middle of service one Sunday morning that was clearly on some type of drug...she was foaming at the mouth literally and sweating profusely saying a lot of things that didn't make any sense. My wife was sitting the foyer with our 3 yr old and 6 mth old sons so she came in the sanctuary (nervously) and got my attention (I sit in the sound booth at the rear of the church), so I grab another deacon and we went out to confront this lady to see what was up. We had to literally stop her from going into the sanctuary as she was so adamant about getting to the pastor to give him her "revelation" that God gave to her right in the middle of service. Now we had no idea if she was armed or not, but we were able to finally get her back out the front doors and told her to leave or we will call the police to have her removed from the premises. We still don't know to this day if she had any intensions of doing harm but it sure did raise our awareness of security.

 

[Treo]

We had to literally stop her from going into the sanctuary as she was so adamant about getting to the pastor to give him her "revelation" that God gave to her right in the middle of service. Now we had no idea if she was armed or not, but we were able to finally get her back out the front doors and told her to leave or we will call the police to have her removed from the premises.

I would have handled that completely differently I would have taken her right into the middle of the service and got about 4 or 5 elders of the church to pray for her deliverence


If I carry in church because of fear, or because I don't think God can get the Job done ( really one & the same reason) It is a sin for me to carry in church,

After reading this it occurs to me that it should read

If I carry anywhere because of fear, or because I don't think God can get the Job done ( really one & the same reason) It is a sin for me to carry period end of disscussion.,

 

[hammer826]

Treo,

How about you don't carry because you are afraid, how about you carry because you are not afraid to do the right thing and protect those you love.

 

[HootmonSccy]

To give an example as to one of the reasons why I decided to cc in the church: We had a lady to stop by right in the middle of service one Sunday morning that was clearly on some type of drug...she was foaming at the mouth literally and sweating profusely saying a lot of things that didn't make any sense. My wife was sitting the foyer with our 3 yr old and 6 mth old sons so she came in the sanctuary (nervously) and got my attention (I sit in the sound booth at the rear of the church), so I grab another deacon and we went out to confront this lady to see what was up. We had to literally stop her from going into the sanctuary as she was so adamant about getting to the pastor to give him her "revelation" that God gave to her right in the middle of service. Now we had no idea if she was armed or not, but we were able to finally get her back out the front doors and told her to leave or we will call the police to have her removed from the premises. We still don't know to this day if she had any intentions of doing harm but it sure did raise our awareness of security.

God is NOT the author of confusion.. She would have surely caused confusion in the service, so it probably was NOT from God..
Best to get here removed. As it was said, she could have been taken to the the side and prayed for and try to determine exactly what her deal was, but to disrupt the service is NOT the Order of God..
IF she really feels she has a revelation, then she should make an appointment with the pastors secretary..

 

[Treo]

This is more religious than gun but I came up in a Charismatic Full gospel Church and I believe in the laying on of hands and the gifts of the Spirit. Our services tend to be a little more fluid than what you might see in a liturgical church service but we believe in allowing room for the Holy Spirit to move and change the order of the service if He chooses. IMO one of the missions of the church is to cast out demons and unless I had a clear leading otherwise, yes I would have disrupted the service to do so.

 

[albritton77]

Yep. I carry concealed in Church.
I've never "announced" or requested permission from the pastor because there is no legal clause in Colorado law to do so.

So... my Glock 22 goes with me --- even in Church.