I don`t understand when people say the answer to a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun and that is not the answer to the problem or it`s wrong .When you call 911 is that not what people are doing calling a good guy.It makes it sound like we the lawfull people are all bad guys and that we should not respond or do anything.Just wanted to know how other people look at this.
Bad guy vs good guy
- Thread starter BruceG
- Start date
My opinionis that it's not the wrong answer. If you have a bad guy with a gun, if possible, call 911. But remember, it takes time for the police to respond to the situation. So the good guy with a gun just might be the solution to prevent murder (on any scale). Hope that made sense.
Kalamity023
New member
You could not be more wrong. A "Good Guy" is any law abiding citizen. We're considered good guys because we abide by the law, treat others with respect and compassion. That being said we a choose to carry for whatever the reason. Someone who does not abide by the law, and is intent in doing harm to others, is a bad guy. If they are so intent in harming others that they force law abiding citizens to protect themselves, calling 911 is not the option I prefer to take. 911 is too slow. The police exist to execute the
laws after they have been broken. Thats why there's a thing called the 4th Amendment. They carry a gun to protect themselves not you. Saying a Good Guy with a gun will help to further the cause for defensive carry.
laws after they have been broken. Thats why there's a thing called the 4th Amendment. They carry a gun to protect themselves not you. Saying a Good Guy with a gun will help to further the cause for defensive carry.
Bruce, I live about a mile from a police station. Our cops do a fabulous job, and every one that I've met is an awesome individual. But if a person calls, the cops can't teleport to the scene. Response time in my neighborhood is only 5 to 10 minutes. A lot can happen in 5 to 10 minutes. After I've called the police, should I ask an attacker to pause and have tea and cookies while we wait? Five minutes is an eternity when you are being attacked. How many times can a man punch me, kick me, pistol whip me in five minutes? He could rape me in that amount of time. He could most certainly kill me. The cops may interrupt him in his crime, but by then I could be severely injured or dead. I have no desire to shoot someone or to ever even draw my firearm. But I also desire to live, and I will defend my life by every means possible. That includes shooting the jacka$$ who comes at me causing me to fear for my life.
Glock27060
Glock27060
I believe that as well, but just remember, if you are carrying concealed you are not a police officer. You have the right to protect yourself and others if under serious threat. If all the perp wants is money and he threatens no one, be observant, be compliant and give him the money.
So let me understand this, I am to somehow know to an absolute certainty that when he comes up to me and wants my money that he has no intention of harming me even if I have the means to be sure of my own safety. Have at it Glock. If you do not appreciate that a reasonable assumption of imminent threat includes someone strong-arming you for your money then all I can do is shake my head and say to you--
Good luck
dad45acp
New member
Terrible advice. Past encounters such as you mentioned have been deterred by just the presentation of your firearm. People just don't usually come up to someone and demand money without making a threat anyway. If I'm being criminalized, I'm pulling my firearm which is a demonstration of non-lethal force to protect myself and property. Most States' laws that I've looked into allow for this without any charges being brought on the victim carrier. Be sure you know your laws......
Bill Cavalieri
New member
About a mile north of me last year a van full of bad guys were interrupted while trying to steal a TV from a house. The two unarmed ladies were trying to cooperate but didn't have money in their pockets like they wanted. So they shot them both killing one. The bad buys put no value on your life so die compliant if you choose but don't preach it to me.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
It is rarely that simple. For one thing, unless you're a mind-reader, you cannot know what "all the perp wants," be it money, your shoes, a roll with your ol' lady, or heck, maybe he just gets a kick out of torture. If he's armed and he's threatening me or mine in any way, I'm not waiting to find what is "all he wants." Now, if he has the drop on me, of course I'm waiting until I can reasonably make a move while minimizing the chances of being noticed, but waiting for a tactical advantage is very different than waiting to see whether he's out for money or out for blood. If he makes it known that he's armed, that's good enough for me, he means to harm me or mine in the process of trying to victimize me/us in whatever other ways.
This issue of waiting was covered extensively in a thread several months ago about a shooting that happened in Spartanburg, SC. It was an interesting study in how many here who participated in the thread think about their responsibilities, duty, or lack of same when danger is threatening, but shots haven't been fired yet. It's a long thread, but what sets it apart from other "good-guy/bad-guy" threads, is that the good-guy shooter showed up to set the record straight on why he fired when he fired. Check it out if you're interested.
On the OP here, either I misunderstood Bruce's meaning, or everybody else seems to have. I think he's saying that he doesn't understand why anyone would say it's wrong to say that the answer to a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. I don't think he was saying it's wrong to say that, he doesn't understand why anyone else would say it's wrong to say that. I had to read it a couple of times because it was written kinda clumsily, and that said, maybe I did misunderstand and everyone else read it correctly, but that's what I think anyway, and if I read it right, I agree with him.
Blues
Look first and foremost the person who went through the training if needed(ie was not sure how to safely handle a firearm and wanted to learn more before obtaining his or her ltch or ccw what every the terminology might be in your area) Once that person commences carrying a firearm for their protecting the lives of themselves and their family they are doing so because you can not know when evil will come to call! I can tell you that I was approached by criminal who sought to relieve me of my wallet when I was exiting my car in Gary. The CRMNAL was in the process of trying to point his gun at me when I was trying to exit my car He made clear his intentions he did not want to ask how my day was going, he was using a firearm to commit a crime, ie arrmed robbery! AT the time I was not carrying becuase my work rules will not allow for it in the company car. And had I been carrying at the time I most likely would not have felt the need to draw unless the situaton escalated. He had the appearance of being someone that was going through withdrawl he was unsteady he arms were shaking and most importanly I could clearly see that the saftey was engaged on his semi auto pistol. So I opened my car door directly into him, sending him off of his feet and meeting the concrete very quickly. Problem solved! Most people who carry firearms do so as a tool and only to be used as a last resort in order to stop a threat. Our media you cant call it journalism anymore, does not report on such cases when law abiding citizens act responsibly to ensure their own saftey and those around them especially when it involves the lawful use of a firearm. They would rather criticise good responsible people for exercising their rights they were endowed with! Look at that house wife in Georgia who first tried to avoid the threat, she made sure her doors were locked and did not open it for the would be intruder, next she hid with her children, finally after exhausting all options she fired at the intruder six tmes emptying her revolver. She hit him 5 times according to officials then she was out of ammuniton. When her situation was debated on a radio show with regards to capcity limits person on the left sought to demonize her stating that it was her fault she should have been better prepared to use the weapon! Instead of accepting that this might have been a case to illustrate the need for more than 7 rounds. So once again it is the law abiding person who is at fault not the criminal who brought a crowbar to a gun fignt!
No, carrying a gun doesn't make you a police officer, you can't go investigating, chase after, and arrest them after the fact. But you can damn sure do something to stop a crime in progress and particularly a crime against yourself. Most if not all states allow for a citizen's arrest if you personally witness the commission or attempted commission of a felony, and an armed robbery would certainly qualify. That's not to say you should draw in every circumstance, if they've got the drop on you and a glock pointed at your head drawing would be foolish unless you can get them distracted first, and I'm not a fan of 'brandishing' to diffuse a situation, if it clears leather it's most likely going to be fired unless there is some INSTANT capitulation.
J
JSDinTexas
Guest
Yeah, I'll give him the money, wrapped in a .45 200 grain +P. What an incredibly stupid comment.
glockshooter9125
New member
Look, I am not telling you not to protect yourself or your family in these situations. I am telling you that it is hard to protect your family from a jail or prison cell. I have seen this first hand there is always some prosecutor somewhere up the chain that is looking to make their mark. There was a comment here about pulling the gun for effect or to scare the perp. There was an encounter in NC about 5 years ago where a buddy of mine worked the case. A bad guy attempted to hold up a bar and its patrons one of the patrons produced a weapon pointed it at the perp and fired several times. The perp fired at the patron several times to insure his escape, none of the rounds hit anybody. The perp was identified by a tattoo on his hand and arrested a short time later. The patron who brandished and fired the weapon was charged with "brandishing" a firearm and "reckless endangerment" for firing. If you are ever in that position (God forbid) there will be a lot of things running through your mind, make the best decision you can to stay alive. Be aware however that you may have to deal with an over achieving prosecutor down the line. Be responsible and be reasonable and above all be alive and free as that is the best way to take care of you and yours.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
There are situations similar to the one you describe where everything goes just right for the good-guy-shooter too though. It boils down to being aware of the qualifying circumstances in which drawing and/or firing your weapon is legal in your jurisdiction, and being aware of who the officials are that will be tasked with judging the rightness or wrongness of your actions and taking you to court if they decide you were wrong. In the case I linked to above, a young bad guy was killed by a good guy who was not being threatened at the time he fired, but he never saw a day in court and his Sheriff stood with him right from the start.
I'm not saying you're wrong for giving the advice you're giving. I'm just saying different circumstances require different actions. It's rarely as black and white as just giving an anecdotal example and extrapolating that every scenario should be handled that way, or differently as the case may be.
Blues
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