Another shooting at the Cardinals/Raiders game. Here we go again.......

gunsandgardens

Brian F.
Don't these idiots know that it's preseason? No details have been released yet but I'm pretty sure about how this went down. Same sh1t every year. A large majority (not all) of raiders fans are ruining this game for everyone else. Leave your issues at home!!!!!! This so called "silver and black pride" is not pride at all. It's a disgrace to the NFL and all the fans.

It's not the teams fault...It's YOU....the deranged fans that just have to cause trouble no matter if their team loses or wins. IMHO the raiders need to be moved out of Oakland. You might say this won't solve anything but lets see how much "team dedication" there is when they get moved to Utah. The Salt Lake City Raiders has a nice ring to it don't you think?


Link Removed
 
I couldn't care any less about football, but out of curiosity I read your link. There's literally no details other than there was an altercation in the parking lot and one actor shot the other actor. How does this have anything to do with which team the shooter was a fan of? And who's to say with the information that's (un)available at that link that the shooting wasn't justified?

I found the first comment salient:

fan4pats2 August 18, 2012 11:01 amThere is a lot of violence here in the Phoenix area everyday. Why should football fans be immune to it? Today there will 2 or 3 more shootings reported. This isn't about football --- at all.


Seems to me that you kind of umm....jumped the gun on this one.

Blues
 
I couldn't care any less about football, but out of curiosity I read your link. There's literally no details other than there was an altercation in the parking lot and one actor shot the other actor. How does this have anything to do with which team the shooter was a fan of? And who's to say with the information that's (un)available at that link that the shooting wasn't justified?

I found the first comment salient:

[/B]

Seems to me that you kind of umm....jumped the gun on this one.

Blues

You may be right and that's why I stated that no information has been released and that I was "pretty sure" about what happened. I may be completely wrong about this one but the reputation of these fans speaks very loudly. You, not caring less about the sport, probably wouldn't know that though. And just for your information, almost every one of the reports on these type of situations has written (one way or another) "It's unclear whether a team rivalry played a role in the shooting." Seems to be a popular trend to be "unclear". That's bull. Other teams in the NFL have their crazy fans too but Oakland holds the crown. Just google "Oakland raiders fan violence".....Then tell me how you feel.
 
seems kind of odd that california has a "gun related crime" in a state that all of that significant gun control. what happened? couldn't the cops precent this act of violence?

ps ....i am a football fan and it does seem that the raiders seem to have more than thier share of violence at thier games. oakland is a less than wholesome place to live from what i have heard and read. seems that california has more gangs and associated violence than it has sunshine,pretty beaches, and wineries. maybe they should send out some of those "bad ass" actors to quell the violence, no wait, they don't live in those neighborhoods do they..........never mind.
 
CCW people have to remember there are a lot of beer guzling football fanatics at every game. Some of these loudmouth idiots carry guns also, whether legal or not. As a CCW you want to remember that you have sworn to use your gun for defending your life or others. The loud mouth with beer flowing down his shirt may just pull out his gun and start shooting.

Not a good idea to get into any arguments or shouting matches with them. Do your best to stay away from them, and if they bother you too much try and get security or police. However, watch them close enough so if they pull out a gun you can draw yours.

Bit of a touchy situation, but thankfully most of them do not carry guns.

:victory:
 
Just google "Oakland raiders fan violence".....Then tell me how you feel.

This is really a weird request. It seems you want me to Google "Oakland Raiders fan violence" and then *feel* that the shooting in your OP was necessarily committed by a rabid Raiders fan based on whatever completely unrelated information the search garners.

That was really the point of my first post. To divine such an absurd conclusion out of nothing but the fact that it happened in the parking lot where the Raiders were playing a pre-season game is not reasonable. I won't be following your suggestion or your lead.

Blues
 
Just google "Oakland raiders fan violence".....Then tell me how you feel.

This is really a weird request. It seems you want me to Google "Oakland Raiders fan violence" and then *feel* that the shooting in your OP was necessarily committed by a rabid Raiders fan based on whatever completely unrelated information the search garners.

That was really the point of my first post. To divine such an absurd conclusion out of nothing but the fact that it happened in the parking lot where the Raiders were playing a pre-season game is not reasonable. I won't be following your suggestion or your lead.

Blues

That was a rhetorical statement. Don't "want" you to do anything. Don't want you to "feel" any different. A search would have simply confirmed the "reputation" that the Raiders fans have. If that's how you took that though... Right on. :)
 
That was a rhetorical statement. Don't "want" you to do anything. Don't want you to "feel" any different. A search would have simply confirmed the "reputation" that the Raiders fans have. If that's how you took that though... Right on. :)

The point is, "feelings" are no substitute for facts. "Reputation" of a given group of people has no bearing on how the "altercation" started, why the shooter felt the need to shoot, or whether or not he was justified in shooting, even if he does belong to the group you wish for us to accept your own guess of that he is. Even if your guess is right that he's a Raiders fan, without the facts of the shooting itself, and what led up to it, his status as such would be completely irrelevant.

Your post had little to do with guns, and everything to do with having an ax to grind against a sports team and their fans. Weird.

Blues
 
crazy they have folks divided over foot ball games too ........smmfh wake up sheeple just going to those games supports stupidity and shady inside dealings for entertainment purposes only what good does it do the world this senseless scam entertainment
 
The point is, "feelings" are no substitute for facts. "Reputation" of a given group of people has no bearing on how the "altercation" started, why the shooter felt the need to shoot, or whether or not he was justified in shooting, even if he does belong to the group you wish for us to accept your own guess of that he is. Even if your guess is right that he's a Raiders fan, without the facts of the shooting itself, and what led up to it, his status as such would be completely irrelevant.

Your post had little to do with guns, and everything to do with having an ax to grind against a sports team and their fans. Weird.

Blues

Wow....you really are still going on about this. What happened to "I won't be following your suggestion or your lead." Who's got the axe to grind now man?

Here Blues.....

Fan Shot Near University of Phoenix Stadium During Cardinals-Raiders NFL Preseason Game

I "suggest" that you read the last paragraph of the article.

Can we move on now?
 
Wow....you really are still going on about this. What happened to "I won't be following your suggestion or your lead."

Your suggestion was that I Google some string of words that have nothing to do with firearms (this is the General Firearms Discussion forum) on the basis that it might influence the way I "feel" about Raiders fans, whom I started out saying I couldn't care any less about. "What happened" to that was I did exactly what I said I was going to do; not follow such an absurd suggestion.

Your "lead" was that you based your conjecture about what happened on only one piece of irrelevant information; that there were Raiders fans in the vicinity. "What happened" to that is that I did not follow your lead, just like I said I wouldn't. Instead, I said facts were missing and dismissed your obvious prejudice against Raiders fans as irrelevant to the shooting, because at this point, with the lack of available information, it is.

Who's got the axe to grind now man?

As far as I can tell, you still do, man.


Wow! The Huffington Post??? That is the only site you could come up with to disprove or defend against you having an ax to grind? I guess it didn't occur to you that HuffPo is as anti-gun as websites come, so maybe saying you seem to have an ax to grind isn't so far-fetched if that's where you go to get your information, hmmm?

This is the paragraph you suggested I read, which I did, even though I feel so dirty now:

Unfortunately, there is ample precedent for such violence amongst fans, even at preseason NFL games. Last year, two men were shot and wounded outside of a preseason game at Candlestick Park between the Raiders and the San Francisco 49ers.

This is precisely the kind of drivel that inspires me to dismiss and ignore anything that originates at HuffPo. There is not one single word in the preceding text of that link that establishes either party to the altercation were fans of either team, or even NFL fans at all. All that link does is reinforce your own biases and prejudices, at the very least against Raiders fans, and at worst, against even concealed carriers. Until you have some facts to offer about the incident, every post you make will simply serve to further illustrate those biases and prejudices.

At least HuffPo was a little more objective and/or complete in their reporting than your OP, as they cite the shooter as having said to cops that the shooting was an accident. Absolutely nothing you have linked to, however, suggests that the shooter was either a Raiders fan, or even in the vicinity because of the game to begin with (which was still being played in the 3rd Quarter at the time of the altercation, also according to HuffPo).

The only ax I have to grind is against conjecture, prejudice, wild-assed-guesses, anti-gun drivel, and the Huffington Post. Your blatant reliance on those issues become more and more apparent with each post. If you're done showin' 'em, then sure, I'm more than willing to be done commenting on them.

Blues
 
Your suggestion was that I Google some string of words that have nothing to do with firearms (this is the General Firearms Discussion forum) on the basis that it might influence the way I "feel" about Raiders fans, whom I started out saying I couldn't care any less about. "What happened" to that was I did exactly what I said I was going to do; not follow such an absurd suggestion.

Blues

Again.....rhetorical statement. You only absorb what seems to be beneficial to your argument and nothing else. You're right though. A shooting takes place outside of an NFL game and it has absolutely nothing to do with firearms.

You seem to be a very angry person Blues. Be honest with me, you're a Raiders fan and that is what this is really all about.
 
Guys! Young Inner city Punkass wannabe gang bangers have been identifying with the Raiders for at least 15 years.
I took my 15 year old daughter to a skating rink that was not her normal rink, 15 years ago.
Saw a bunch of "punks in Raider jackets" hanging around the rink.
I had to listen to her ***** at me all the way home when I refused to let her go.
Oh yeah there was a stabbing there that night.
 
Again.....rhetorical statement. You only absorb what seems to be beneficial to your argument and nothing else. You're right though. A shooting takes place outside of an NFL game and it has absolutely nothing to do with firearms.

Not what I said. I said your OP was less about guns than it was about an opportunity to rant against Raiders fans. Now it seems to be about twisting what I did say to fit some template that will make you feel like you are winning. I'm going to start calling you Charlie Sheen.

You seem to be a very angry person Blues. Be honest with me, you're a Raiders fan and that is what this is really all about.

I have been honest. I couldn't care any less about football or the Raiders or their fans. And I'm not angry at all. I just still think you jumped the gun trying to make an incomplete story into a justifiable knock on a group of people that are not established as having a single thing to do with it. And doing it under the false pretense that you're talking about guns or the details of a use of a gun that we could all join in and evaluate if the details were actually available, is bad form. Of course, that's just my opinion, and my opinion means nothing around here, but I'm neither angry about that fact, nor at you, nor at this thread. I just think it's stupid.

Blues
 
Who said if you argue with an idiot it will be hard for others to tell who the idiot is?

But being a San Diego native and long time Charger fan......people here must not know anything about Raider fans they have ALWAYS been out of hand but yes now "Thugs" have joined the bandwagon because of the tradition the Raiders have and the "just win baby" attitude.

Gun, maybe off topic but has a MOD done anything? So, I'm guessing not a problem. I'm just saying!
 
Who said if you argue with an idiot it will be hard for others to tell who the idiot is?

But being a San Diego native and long time Charger fan......people here must not know anything about Raider fans they have ALWAYS been out of hand but yes now "Thugs" have joined the bandwagon because of the tradition the Raiders have and the "just win baby" attitude.

Gun, maybe off topic but has a MOD done anything? So, I'm guessing not a problem. I'm just saying!

Grew up in Redondo Beach. The Raiders practiced on a field at El Segundo Middle School, just 4 or 5 miles from my home, when they were in LA. I know a lot about them and about their reputation. Hardly the point. Lot's of thugs wear hats and other merchandise that say Chevy or whatever on it too. Does that make all Chevy fans thugs? You guys are missing the point entirely, but carry on calling others names while you try to convince us that Chargers fans or Cardinals fans or whoever are "better" than Raiders fans. It's a freakin' football team. Thugs and gangsters are thugs and gangsters, and would be whether there was a team named the Oakland Raiders or not. But go ahead and rant about Raiders fans on a gun forum if it makes y'all feel like winners Charlie.

Blues
 

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