America is a Christian Nation


Atty Stu

New member
My law degree does not make me necessarily right or wrong. I have more experience to draw on than a non-lawyer, but I absolutely get it wrong. Today's Lobby Hobby ruling is a classic example. The summaries of the case arguments didn't focus on the closely held corp. exception and the law professor who I heard speak on it, glazed over the point. It seems critical to the Court's decision.

Any time the US Supreme Court agrees to hear a case, there is room for doubt which way it will go. Today's ruling was 5-4 certainly demonstrates that reasonable minds can differ.

Any way, take care.
 

SR9

New member
Before everybody gets all crazy trying to spin the SCOTUS decision and blow it out of proportion, there is only one thing to know. This decision really only says that Hobby Lobby and like privately owned businesses have the right to decline to pay for 4, yes 4, specific abortive drugs, based on religious beliefs. It does not ban abortions. People can still have them at their own expense. They can still get the 4 abortive drugs, but at their own expense. Private companies have the right to refuse to pay for them. I've heard people on the media claiming all kinds of false statements as to what this decision does, but in reality this is it. Want an abortion or abortive drug, pay for it yourself. It is not your private employers responsibility. This does not apply to publicly owned corporations.
 

Debray

New member
From the removal of the King America was a Christian Nation

Christian Anarchism is grounded in the belief that there is only one source of authority to which Christians are ultimately answerable, the authority of God as embodied in the teachings of Jesus, and thus rejects the idea that human governments have ultimate authority over human societies.

The final verse of the Book of Judges (Judges 21:25) states that there was no king in Israel and that "everyone did as they saw fit". Subsequently, as recorded in the first Book of Samuel (1 Samuel 8) the people of Israel wanted a king "so as to be like other nations". God declared that the people had rejected him as their king. He warned that a human king would lead to militarism, corruption, and taxation, and that their pleas for mercy from the king's demands would go unanswered. Samuel passed on God's warning to the Israelites but they still demanded a king, and Saul became their ruler.

With the Declaration of Independence, War, and finally the Constitution of the United States, America removed their King and put God back in control, but slowly the American People just like the Israelites demanded a King and Obama became Our Ruler.

The CONSTITUTION of the United States
105th CONGRESS 1st SESSION/SENATE DOCUMENT 105-11
The Declaration of Independence was the promise; the Constitution was the fulfillment. ``The sacred rights of mankind are not to be rummaged for, among old parchments, or musty records. They are written, as with a sun beam in the whole volume of human nature, by the hand of the divinity itself; and can never be erased or obscured by mortal power.'' Alexander Hamilton, 1775

Link Removed
 

nosreme

Member
...With the Declaration of Independence, War, and finally the Constitution of the United States, America removed their King and put God back in control...

So why does the Constitution not contain the word "god?" Why were so many of the "founding fathers" so adamantly opposed to mixing religion with government (notwithstanding the highly selective, out-of-context, and often downright fabricated quotes to the contrary)?

I'm starting to reconsider even more seriously my longstanding reservations about the notion that all religious people are mentally ill (or at least socially maladjusted misfits), when it appears increasingly that many (not all or even most-mainly the loud, incessant drumbeaters) definitely are.
 

Oldgrunt

Well-known member
So why does the Constitution not contain the word "god?" Why were so many of the "founding fathers" so adamantly opposed to mixing religion with government (notwithstanding the highly selective, out-of-context, and often downright fabricated quotes to the contrary)?

I'm starting to reconsider even more seriously my longstanding reservations about the notion that all religious people are mentally ill (or at least socially maladjusted misfits), when it appears increasingly that many (not all or even most-mainly the loud, incessant drumbeaters) definitely are.

You and I know each other's stand on God and religion so I will not try to interject anything biblical here. Reading the Constitution and The Articles of Confederation, the word "God" is not specifically mentioned. However, when dates are given for the passage of said documents, their is generally the reference, "Done in the year of our Lord.........." and "Whereas it hath pleased the Great Governor of the World to incline hearts...", I believe those statements to be indicative of the religious belief of our founding fathers and the populace in general at that time. They were adamant in forbidding the establishment of a national religion but did not prohibit the free exercise of religion in the nation. The First Amendment has been so beaten and bounced around that it hardly resembles the purpose for which I think it was established. Where it may not specifically mention God, I feel the inference can be made that they were religious people after all and would be sorely displeased with the current attitude toward religion. I am sorry you consider religious people to be the bane of society but we, in our own beliefs, do have the welfare of others at heart. One day, the truth will be known to all, to some, frightfully so, and to others, delightfully so. I do enjoy the repartee however.
 

Ringo

A WATCHMAN
So why does the Constitution not contain the word "god?" Why were so many of the "founding fathers" so adamantly opposed to mixing religion with government (notwithstanding the highly selective, out-of-context, and often downright fabricated quotes to the contrary)?

I'm starting to reconsider even more seriously my longstanding reservations about the notion that all religious people are mentally ill (or at least socially maladjusted misfits), when it appears increasingly that many definitely are.
Once again,when confronted with any debate an atheist is only able to issue negative commentary because their hatred of God gets in the way of any common sense. Being of their father the devil atheists have the nearest alliance to Satan. An awful state of degenerates, God's truth terrifies them. Their only hope is that there is no afterlife, their greatest fear is that there is. Because atheists partake of the same principles and propensities which characterize the very nature and essence of their father the devil, these mindless mockers will never go away or shut up. Because the sole purpose of these non-believers existence revolves around attacking the validity of the Holy Bible, as is evident here, they will to continue to rage and foolishly waste our time.
 

nosreme

Member
...I am sorry you consider religious people to be the bane of society...

Only the ones who believe that their religious beliefs should drive (and limit and shape) education, science, medicine, public health, rights of others, law, policy, content of various forms of entertainment, etc, etc...those who sanctimoniously screech and preach on street corners, parks, and now on the internet about their own moral superiority and the forever-imminent end of the world...those who engage in religion-based intimidation and discrimination but who piously yell "religion is under attack" and "we're being persecuted for our faith" when they get it in return...and those who are obsessed with others' genitals and what they do with them.
 

Debray

New member
This is one of the best explanations of the different types of government I have seen and now I know Anarchy is not the way. Republic vs. Democracy - What Is The Real Form of the U.S. Government - YouTube

The problem is we are being controlled by the majority that has turned our Republic into a Democracy and we are well on our way to an Oligarchy lead by Idiots.

We were much better off being lead by the God that guided our Founders and enabled them to draft a Constitution that has been the envy of the world.
 

BluesStringer

Les Brers
This is one of the best explanations of the different types of government I have seen and now I know Anarchy is not the way. Republic vs. Democracy - What Is The Real Form of the U.S. Government - YouTube

The problem is we are being controlled by the majority that has turned our Republic into a Democracy and we are well on our way to an Oligarchy lead by Idiots.

We were much better off being lead by the God that guided our Founders and enabled them to draft a Constitution that has been the envy of the world.

Agree wholeheartedly with your post, Debray.

Some further information about that link that you and others may (or may not) find interesting. I first found that Link Removed posted on a site called "wimp.com" in 2008. It is difficult to tell that it is only a segment of a longer production, and wimp.com doesn't even give as much info as the YouTube poster you linked to, but I was curious about its origins so I went looking for its authors/producers back in '09.

It is actually a presentation by John McManus, President of The John Birch Society, entitle, "Overview of America." It was originally marketed by JBS in a 29-minute DVD that Link Removed, and was posted by JBS for free access in 2012 on YouTube, embedded below for your viewing pleasure.

The segment that Debray linked to is the ~second third of the half-hour presentation. The first eight-minute segment is very basic American history 101 kind of stuff, but from my experience, many folks on this forum should pay closer attention to those first eight minutes than they obviously did in high school history or civics classes.
cry2.gif


I suggest everyone watch, but more importantly, actually listen to the whole 29 minutes. Here ya go....


 

SR9

New member
Nosreme

One of the first signs of mental illness is that you think you are ok and everyone else is mentally ill. Better go see a shrink. Just sayin'.........
 

XD40scinNC

New member
Once again,when confronted with any debate an atheist is only able to issue negative commentary because their hatred of God gets in the way of any common sense. Being of their father the devil atheists have the nearest alliance to Satan. An awful state of degenerates, God's truth terrifies them. Their only hope is that there is no afterlife, their greatest fear is that there is. Because atheists partake of the same principles and propensities which characterize the very nature and essence of their father the devil, these mindless mockers will never go away or shut up. Because the sole purpose of these non-believers existence revolves around attacking the validity of the Holy Bible, as is evident here, they will to continue to rage and foolishly waste our time.
And the belief in a god represents common sense. What you are clearly blinded to by your beliefs is that atheists don't hate gods, for we recognize they are the product of ancient ignorance dating back to when man understood virtually nothing of their world. There is nothing there to hate, any more than one would hate the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy or Santa.

What is frustrating is that believers cling to ignorance of people that have been dead for thousands of years with such tenacity now that we understand that the sun is not drug across the sky on a chariot every day.
 

Ringo

A WATCHMAN
And the belief in a god represents common sense. What you are clearly blinded to by your beliefs is that atheists don't hate gods, for we recognize they are the product of ancient ignorance dating back to when man understood virtually nothing of their world. There is nothing there to hate, any more than one would hate the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy or Santa.

What is frustrating is that believers cling to ignorance of people that have been dead for thousands of years with such tenacity now that we understand that the sun is not drug across the sky on a chariot every day.
ONCE AGAIN,when confronted with any debate an atheist is only able to issue negative commentary because their hatred of God gets in the way of any common sense. Being of their father the devil atheists have the nearest alliance to Satan. An awful state of degenerates, God's truth terrifies them. Their only hope is that there is no afterlife, their greatest fear is that there is. Because atheists partake of the same principles and propensities which characterize the very nature and essence of their father the devil, these mindless mockers will never go away or shut up. The sole purpose of these non-believers existence revolves around attacking the validity of the Holy Bible, as is evident here, they will ONCE AGAIN continue to rage and foolishly waste our time. :drag:


~ Everyone In Hell Is A Believer...It's Just Too Late ~
 

nosreme

Member
Ye of little or no faith will suffer the most.

I can't imagine a life driven by fear of mythical post-death eternal punishment--or by expectation/hope of some equally mythical glorious afterlife. Rational being that I am, I would change my mind in the proverbial heartbeat if anybody could produce any credible evidence of the existence of either (or of the similarly mythical soul implicit in both).
 

Oldgrunt

Well-known member
I don't have the words to give you a debate on eschatology. I don't have great debating skills but I can produce all the evidence a rational man, who could look at it in a completely objective manner, would need. It is what some have described as a dusty old book of myths and outdated in modern society. It is the Bible. If one can be completely objective, you will see that the Bible validates itself over and over and over. It is an historical book that provides one with evidence of history of today from the beginning of history as we know it. Predictions were made by the Bible of things that would occur many years in the future and, with a little study, one can find the evidence to show the fulfillment of those things actually happened. That evidence is in history books as well as the Bible. The coming of Jesus was predicted many years in advance of His arrival and His mission in life foretold in the salvation of mankind. His death was foretold in the Old Testament and verified in the New Testament. The current travail of the world was foretold many years ago and descriptions of today's world were given with extreme accuracy. Since the Bible verifies itself over and over, I fail to see how one can deny it and reject Jesus' offering of everlasting life with Him in Heaven. If I were to be allowed only one book in this world, I would select the Bible which is not based on theories but absolute fact. I believe science and the Bible together. They are not mutually exclusive. Can't have one without the other. And one last piece of evidence I believe is what is happening right now in the Middle East. Having read the book, I feel I know the ending already and believe we ALL will be seeing Jesus in the not too distant future. I wish I had the ability to impart to you the necessary words for you to understand how I (and WE) feel and could lead you to Christ. Maybe one day.......
 

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