~All nine bystanders were wounded by 'police' bullets~

[The_Outlaw]

NEW YORK — The encounter was breathtakingly brief: a surveillance video showed a gunman outside the Empire State Building on Friday pulling a pistol, pointing it at two police officers, their firing at him and his falling to the sidewalk.
All the yelling and cries of pain occurred out of camera view, just north of where the gunman, Jeffrey T. Johnson, collapsed and died: nine bystanders were struck, cradling bloody arms or lying on the sidewalks and curbs.
The police commissioner, Raymond W. Kelly, confirmed on Saturday that all nine were wounded by police bullets, bullet fragments or shrapnel from ricochets. Mr. Kelly also confirmed that the shooter, Mr. Johnson, never fired another shot after killing a former co-worker, Steven Ercolino, moments earlier.
“We had a witness that said that Johnson fired at the police,” Mr. Kelly said Saturday. “But the final count of the shells, it appears that that is not the case.”

NYT: NYPD under scrutiny after bystanders shot - US news - The New York Times - NBCNews.com

 

[Kalamity023]

Bloomy is so anti-gun he must not let his PD practice. 9 bystanders, not one shot by the perp.. And it was considered a "Good Shooting"
Amazing!

 

[~OtisM~]

They should have gotten out of way. Wonder what ammo the nypd uses? Golden Sabre?

 

[JohnD13]

They should have gotten out of way. Wonder what ammo the nypd uses? Golden Sabre?

In NY city, in the morning crunch, there is no place to get out of the way. You are in a concrete canyon. Any round that missed it's intended target, and that's for another discussion, would have hit someone or something, in flight or as a riccochet.

 

[revolverboy]

I think the point is THAT they missed their intended target. I understand that we don't shoot as well at live, moving targets as we do at paper targets & I get that there's an adrenaline dump and you lose a great amount of skill when that happens. But 8 feet away and 7 of 16 shots hit the bad guy....? Kind of un acceptable.

I talked to a detail cop a few years ago. Said he only shoots to qualify, 2 times a year. Doesn't seem like enough to me.

 

[Flanmedic51]

I believe the shooter was hit around 9 times, torso and extremities. The target was hit...remarkably well. The problem is, is that is NYC has a city block population of 100s of thousands and the cops were invloved in an active shooter scenario and fine motor skills are markedly diminished. It sucks that there was collateral damage here but what alternative did the cops have? Most LE firearms qualifications are simply shooting at a paper target at varying distances...and the targets don't shoot back. IMO any active shooter call, the cops should enter the scene w a long gun/.223 round instead of pistols. Should result in better accuracy and less rounds fired. Not sure what NYPD policies/procedures are...

 

[Blackthorn]

Here is the security camera footage.... Watch it in real time and then slow it down to still clips. The perp pulled his gun and turned to confront the two police officers. They scramble and draw their weapons. The officer on the left comes to a good position both hands on the gun. He probably was the officer who killed the perp. The other officer retreats to the right firing one handed backing up quickly... Not much control there. Think he was reason for the wild shots? Good possiblity. He seems a bit paniced in his retreat. I would say this shows some serious training deficencies.....

New York shooting security footage released - Videos - KTAR.com

 

[Purple]

The other officer retreats to the right firing one handed backing up quickly... Not much control there.

I agree! There are only a few instances that I can think where a one handed engagement should be used and this certainly was not one of them.

 

[Blackthorn]

One handed advancing would be one thing, but he was putting distance between himself and the perp, quickly I might add...

 

[santa]

After the story broke about the 9 innocent people shot all I could think of was what would happen if I as a civilian shot at a threat and missed and hit an innocent. My life would be over as I know it and the cries for more gun-control would be deaffening.

 

[santa]

Also after the story broke I heard a thunderous noise of every LAWYER within hundreds of miles stampeding to New York to offer their services to the victims and in the process reap the reward of a sure fire lawsuit.

 

[walt629]

After the story broke about the 9 innocent people shot all I could think of was what would happen if I as a civilian shot at a threat and missed and hit an innocent. My life would be over as I know it and the cries for more gun-control would be deaffening.

Too true Santa, too true!

 

[The Gun Man]

Wow, they missed the bad guy nine times. Well I guess it was a long shots, 6 feet, if it had only benn 5 feet it may have been better.
This just goes to show that cops need to learn to shoot. Will they be in trouble? If I shot a bad guy and missed nine times hitting bystanders I would be in jail. Why arnt they.
I think this is the part that is BS. Once again I have to say if a lf a legal carrier was there it might have turned out different at the first shooting and the nine would not have
been victoms of the Cops who cant shoot straight. The fact that they shot so many times dosent sit good either. Two well placed trained shoot would do the trick.
NY needs to get a Mator in there that has a brain. People need to be able to defende themselves. I hope the nine sue the city for millions and they fire the JERK Mayor.

 

[Nightmare45]

Looking at shooting if you were armed the cops would have shot you, hell they hit 9 people that had no guns. What training, I shoot more in an average week than the average police officer shoots in a year.

 

[Flanmedic51]

Looking at shooting if you were armed the cops would have shot you, hell they hit 9 people that had no guns. What training, I shoot more in an average week than the average police officer shoots in a year.

Very true. I think there are A LOT of LEO's that are no better trained tactically OR psychologically than a civilian carrier. I know for a fact that myself and many friends send more lead down range than my LEO colleagues in a year. They shoot to qualify...and that's it.

 

[The_Outlaw]

Very true. I think there are A LOT of LEO's that are no better trained tactically OR psychologically than a civilian carrier. I know for a fact that myself and many friends send more lead down range than my LEO colleagues in a year. They shoot to qualify...and that's it.

I agree with both you and 'Nightmare45'...
These NYPD officers definately need WAY more target practice.

 

[canaweb]

Looks like there are now lawsuits pending...